Anyone take kratom w opiates or help transitioning

[boonydandler]

This is not for me and I never used kratom to dome off of opiates even though I was an addict at one or two points. IM trying to help a family member, 2 actually that live far away and its aweird situation. Theyre on norco, or oxy and one is on fentynyl patches. Theyre pretty much victims of the real drug war, the one pharma wages on the citizens. Ive been taking kratom for 6 years and used to frequent reddit, then came here but really dont participate on any forums or do social media. I lurk and have a bunch fo other thinshg that keep me too busy. Anyway, I was looking for some posts on the old reddit or even here and couldnt find much that I can print out and mail to some old people who refuse to compute. The one fentynyl doesnt feel get refeilf from 50mg patches, I dont really know what that is but they are messed up pretty bad, a few cancers, a ton of surgeries and becasue they wont read anything and IM not there to help them in person, i was hesitant on helping them with kratom becasue I just know them and they would not pay attention, not take it, not read about it and I feel like due to its pseudo criminal status, those of us that it really helps have gone doen the anecdotal hole. I did that for a couple years.

Sorry Im always very wordy.

They need help with pain releif , theyre on pankillers, I cant help them get off of those and I know many do but you have to be a bit motivated and able to learn. does anyone have any experience iwth using kratom for breakthrough or in between pain. Im guessing even people use it with. Id love for them to taper and IM hoping they get some results and feel better enough to want to taper. If they call me ready to do it, I'll help a lot more.

Anyone know where there are guides or posts that people have put together. I googled and only see seashells by the seashore rehab, whatever grossness google sells out to so we cant find any actual info. I know there were old reddit posts but has anyone ever ytried searching reddit? maybe its me but I do better searching google with reddit on the end than using reddits search.

Links, IM not being lazy and will still be looking but I have no time nor energy to take trhese people on but am doing it anyway. I got them kratom and a scale and now my partner is wriyting stuff down. We want soe stuff to print out and stuff in an envelope.

My life would be much different without kratom as Im sure many others woulld be too and every once in a while I try and help a junkie across the country.

Thanks for reading my fast scabby writing.

[Kelleytoons]

A couple of things.

Kratom enabled me to completely stop opioids - I wasn't an "abuser" but I was taking 4 to 6 a week, for years, and since I started kratom I've yet to have one single additional pill (those bottles of Oxy and Vicodin sit idle in my medicine cabinet :>).

That said - almost impossible to "help" someone in this regard. They need to be the ones motivated enough to really stick with it. Kratom isn't the same as those pills I was taking - the effects are similar in nature, but not at all a substitute in the strict manner of speaking. What I find with kratom is that it allows me to mitigate the pain I have in a way that traditional medicine does not, and it lets my mind handle it much better than trying to mask it or dope me up. But in my efforts to help two or three others in this regard, folks who held me in high esteem and (I can only assume) followed my advice to the letter, helping others like this is an uphill climb, and everyone I've tried so far has given up.

The best you can do is tell them about kratom and TELL them to at least try it. And do their own research. If they are motivated, truly motivated, they will do the work themselves. And that's the only way it can really work.

[OriginalLHB]

I took 6 Norco per day for 20 years give or take under the direction of a doctor, and then was switched on to Subutex when I was hospitalized for alcoholism in 2019. I have been a chronic alcoholic since I was 16 and have been hospitalized against my will for it 4 times beginning in 1986.

During that entire time, I only went through opiate withdrawal once, for about 5 days a very long time ago, and the results were terrible for me. I have a very high tolerance for physical pain, but a very low tolerance for the pain of withdrawal. For many years, managing my pill supply was the most important consideration in my life. At least when I wasn't enduring one of those years of all day liquor drinking. I decided to quit Subutex in 2020 when I was taking 2 mgs. daily, and I realized it was making me feel like crap, if not as bad as full blown WD.

I quickly realized that it was going to be a nightmare and I managed to make it to a local head shop after reading a little and got some Red Maeng Da and some White Sumatra.. When I took my first 4 gram dose of Red MD, I was stunned by the almost instant level of relief it gave me. The restless legs especially, and the feeling of wanting to jump out of my skin, were almost completely eliminated for about 4 hours. I stayed off pills for about 1 year on Kratom until I discovered a huge cache of Norco that I had stashed away during the wild old days of Florida online vendors, and went back on them. I really love them. Then I finally ran out about 6 months ago and went back on the Subutex. I hate that stuff, and about a month ago decided to quit again.

In my experience, all the research in the world about dosing etc. was meaningless. Just take what you need to get relief as often as you need it. Start at about 3 - 4 grams, and then take about another half gram every 30 minutes until you don't feel sick anymore. After about 2 weeks, you will start to feel less terrified and shaky, and will start to look forward to your Kratom even more than you looked forward to your pills. I have no experience with needle drugs. After white knuckling it with stuff from large online vendors like The Golden Monk I stumbled on Kraken, which had some very decent stuff that I could get overnight, although it is extremely expensive. Then I exhaustively researched the online forums regarding smaller batch vendors, and invested a large sum in trying to acquire the best that I could from those sources.

That made all the difference, because the problem is not just getting off, its staying off. And you have to have an interesting enough experience to substitute for your DOC if you're going to do that.

So after about 40 days, my demeanor is the best I can remember in a long time, even though I am in more pain and more disabled than I was during my entire pill career. People who have known me for a long time have told me over the last few weeks that I seem far more upbeat and happy than my normally grim and humorless self.

I have a vast range of experiences to sample from and that keeps me intellectually and psychologically stimulated. Boredom is my worst enemy, and I have been doing this for so long, I guess I will always need to rely on some kind of mood altering substance to make it through the day. I dose 5 times per day now, at about 2.5 grams during the day, and 3.5-4 in the evening. I still have trouble sleeping but in most ways I feel better than I have in many years. I couldn't care less about being physically dependent, but I find that Kratom has a kind of ceiling effect that keeps just about everybody from true addictive behavior. Kind of like with cigarettes and coffee, both of which I am dependent on, but which I am not addicted to. If you take too much Kratom you get "The Wobbles" which is not dangerous, but very unpleasant. Its a sensation of weakness, unsteadiness, shakiness and nausea, and after that you will automatically moderate to a more pleasant level of consumption. Kind of like if you smoked three cigars in rapid succession or had three double espressos in rapid succession. That will teach you to moderate!

If you are in desperate need, and you have some money, I recommend the bulk vendor Kraken even though they get a lot of hate in these forums. They can get it to you next day without fail, and their OG Bali, Super Indo, White Sumatra and White and Red MD were indispensable during the first week. Then branch off to more boutique sources, but ones that will not be out of a lot of things like Oties and All Natural Artisan (which are my main go to's now). Then branch off into the real good stuff from the real quality smaller vendors, which are often out of a lot of stuff and sell out quickly when they get good new batches. My favorite non private vendors from among those are Benni Botanicals, Fused Flora and Herbal RVA. Then try a few easy to access private vendors like Smiley Time Herbs and Gulf Coast Kratom. Some of the private vendors that people love on this forum are too cloak and dagger for me, so I don't worry about them. It's like getting admitted to an exclusive country club, and you don't need the frustration when you are in WD.

Three words of warning; 1) Everybody says that Reds are the best for opiate withdrawal but that was not the case for me. Fermented or unfermented, they tend to make me feel tired and nervous, although there are exceptions. You may find you like potent Whites or Greens far better like I do. If you just take the advice of the masses and take only Reds thinking that the other strains are too "stimulating" you might end up very disappointed. And don't get too hung up on potency. You don't want garbage, but there are some relatively low potency blends (MIT = 1.2% for example) that provide very interesting experiences when you are ready for something more subtle, but perhaps more complex.

2) Worry more about color than strain. Everybody's Green Bali or White Borneo is different and they all tend to come from a similar place, except for the fact that all Green Bali's are Green and all White Borneo's are White.. Worry more about finding vendors you like, and about which powder color you like.

3) I knew very little about extracts when I started this time, but I know more now. Research, research and research, but know that there are a lot of extracts out there that will knock back all but the worst withdrawals. The drawback is that you need to dose them carefully (I always take them with about half to one-third my normal dose of leaf) and for that you will absolutely need a milligram (0.000 scale). If you use them, use them sparingly as needed when you are super bored or super sick, and rely on leaf powder for the vast majority of your intake, you will be OK. They can carry your experience to the next level however, on those occasions when you need to be there.

It will take a very long time to get accustomed to living without your DOC, especially if you have taken it for decades on a daily basis with nary a day off. I can attest with certainty that without Kratom it would have been impossible for me. I would be back on a liter of vodka per day, and/or looking to score on the street without question. BTW, I am 63 years old and I have had the leisure now to realistically contemplate life without pills, and to confront the depressing reality off how much of my life I wasted running doctors and hoarding my time and my pills to the detriment of every other aspect of life, never mind my daily drinking which surely would have resulted in my demise by now. Kratom is the only alternative for people like me, and I highly recommend beginning the ordeal which will quickly turn into an adventure as soon as possible.

BTW, even though I have been sober from alcohol for over 3 years now Kratom also helps immensely with that. I cannot imagine wanting a drink within 5 hours of taking even a modest dose of Kratom.

[GrannyJ62]

I was on opiods for over 2 decades hydo 10s and morphine er when I found kratom.I first researched as much as I could then I began asking in my chronic pain and fibromyalgia group s if it had helped that's where I found my kratom angel Dixie her vendor was a member of Lizas from Lizasbestbotanicals, she helped me to understand that I needed to find my sweet spot as we are all different in what we need from kratom for me it was pain control and energy I ve suffered with chronic pain and fatigue for a very long time and the pain meds had really stopped working a long time ago I just couldn't stop them.She also explained that it was best to stop taking my scripts and then start kratom because taking both would cause them to both not work only so much room on the pain receptor bus so I took my meds one night and started kratom the next morning one tsp then a half a tsp every 30 minutes until I found relief then once I found my sweet spot to take that amount every 3 to 4 hrs trying to stay ahead of my pain instead of catching up to it.That was 4 yrs ago and I haven't needed or taken a pain pill since as it works better than the pills ever did .I d put it in an empty pill bottle with sunny d shake it up and drink it. I believe kratom has saved my life its definitely allowed me to do things I never thought I would ever be able to do with a clear head and clean energy.

[GrannyJ62]

If your looking for the science facts On Facebook there's a lady named Melody Woolf who has loads of information and is always super happy to share it from her page she's also a chronic pain survivor and a big kratom advocate.

[kwest13]

She also explained that it was best to stop taking my scripts and then start kratom because taking both would cause them to both not work

I'm actually really interested in this. Is this a proven fact? a Majority fact? or just a common theory? I have no information, experience, or opinion on this at all. I just want to know if anyone can shed more light on this.

[BookofEnoch1914]

She also explained that it was best to stop taking my scripts and then start kratom because taking both would cause them to both not work

I'm actually really interested in this. Is this a proven fact? a Majority fact? or just a common theory? I have no information, experience, or opinion on this at all. I just want to know if anyone can shed more light on this.

Certain alkaloids in Kratom are known to block opioids/opiates from binding to the mu receptor. I'm pretty sure it was Dr. McCurdys research that shed light on this? Try an internet search(NOT Google) for the specifics, there is plenty of anecdotal accounts through the years, now there are scientific results to finally back it up.

[kwest13]

She also explained that it was best to stop taking my scripts and then start kratom because taking both would cause them to both not work

I'm actually really interested in this. Is this a proven fact? a Majority fact? or just a common theory? I have no information, experience, or opinion on this at all. I just want to know if anyone can shed more light on this.

Certain alkaloids in Kratom are known to block opioids/opiates from binding to the mu receptor. I'm pretty sure it was Dr. McCurdys research that shed light on this? Try an internet search(NOT Google) for the specifics, there is plenty of anecdotal accounts through the years, now there are scientific results to finally back it up.

So from a mixing standpoint. Taking kratom before an opioid/opiate would potentially block the opioid but taking an opioid and then kratom after wouldn't really negate anything?

[BookofEnoch1914]

I'm actually really interested in this. Is this a proven fact? a Majority fact? or just a common theory? I have no information, experience, or opinion on this at all. I just want to know if anyone can shed more light on this.

Certain alkaloids in Kratom are known to block opioids/opiates from binding to the mu receptor. I'm pretty sure it was Dr. McCurdys research that shed light on this? Try an internet search(NOT Google) for the specifics, there is plenty of anecdotal accounts through the years, now there are scientific results to finally back it up.

So from a mixing standpoint. Taking kratom before an opioid/opiate would potentially block the opioid but taking an opioid and then kratom after wouldn't really negate anything?

Speaking from experience having Kratom in my system then taking an opioid(Oxy) I literally got nothing from the opioid. After that I never mixed the two again. I can't really see Kratom having much of an effect stacked on after taking an opioid....maybe enhanced pain relief? Just a guess. I do know Mitragynine metabolites stick around in our system for 24+ hours, so any consumption of Ops within that time frame would be fairly pointless.

[kwest13]

Certain alkaloids in Kratom are known to block opioids/opiates from binding to the mu receptor. I'm pretty sure it was Dr. McCurdys research that shed light on this? Try an internet search(NOT Google) for the specifics, there is plenty of anecdotal accounts through the years, now there are scientific results to finally back it up.

So from a mixing standpoint. Taking kratom before an opioid/opiate would potentially block the opioid but taking an opioid and then kratom after wouldn't really negate anything?

Speaking from experience having Kratom in my system then taking an opioid(Oxy) I literally got nothing from the opioid. After that I never mixed the two again. I can't really see Kratom having much of an effect stacked on after taking an opioid....maybe enhanced pain relief? Just a guess. I do know Mitragynine metabolites stick around in our system for 24+ hours, so any consumption of Ops within that time frame would be fairly pointless.

Well then there definitely is a question of the individual for that second part. I have taken a LOT of kratom one day. And the next morning taken an opioid and felt it's full effects for the normal time expected. That I am positive. I have also felt the effects when mixing but possibly diminished each other to certain degrees. Also all on empty stomachs.