long term stem n vein usage?

[Mean Malay]

does anyone have any experience with this?

I first started taking stem n vein at higher doses to taper from plain leaf kratom, but decided to do a 50/50 S&V and kratom blend. i dose 5-6 grams 3X per day and wait 5-7 hours per dose. In the beginning, i got a really nice calm buzz from S&V. like a serene meditative state. I was taking much more stem n vein and less kratom, more like a 75/25 blend. That was less than 2 months ago and i don't feel that anymore since i've been doing the 50/50. I feel much shorter lasting burns and the calm mood isn't as prominent.

I'm left thinking i need to readjust my blend. Did the S&V overpower the kratom previously which is why i felt that way? Ever since i've been taking S&V, take only plain leaf kratom has feel weird in a bad way, so i've only used the S & V + kratom blend. I'm wondering about my tolerance to both kratom and S&V as it's really hard to gauge at this point since they're supposed to be synergistic and im blending them. I'm going to experiment and post my results, and start with a higher S&V usage and less kratom and see if that helps first, but i'm wondering if anyone else has a kind of weird relationship with kratom since taking it with S&V.

[brave777]

I dont understand why people dont just pop a new batch that they never had for tolerance breaks instead stem and vein. Reason i say is to get different alkaloid profiles and do it very low, .5 or 1g or 2g depending what your doses were. For example, if you been on 10 grams per day, take 1g early on the day then another 1g later on the day with a new batch or a batch you haven't done in a while and you know its good.

But aint stem and vein meant for tolerance breaks?? I think you mostly felt the kratom and very little from stem vein. But with kratom if breaks not taken tolerance always grows. so it grew to the point where not much felt especially adding stem vein you will feel barley anything. I would advice not mixing and sticking to stem veins when decide to take breaks or another option stop both of them, use something alternative and try again what you tried before.

[fusedflora]

does anyone have any experience with this?

I first started taking stem n vein at higher doses to taper from plain leaf kratom, but decided to do a 50/50 S&V and kratom blend. i dose 5-6 grams 3X per day and wait 5-7 hours per dose. In the beginning, i got a really nice calm buzz from S&V. like a serene meditative state. I was taking much more stem n vein and less kratom, more like a 75/25 blend. That was less than 2 months ago and i don't feel that anymore since i've been doing the 50/50. I feel much shorter lasting burns and the calm mood isn't as prominent.

I'm left thinking i need to readjust my blend. Did the S&V overpower the kratom previously which is why i felt that way? Ever since i've been taking S&V, take only plain leaf kratom has feel weird in a bad way, so i've only used the S & V + kratom blend. I'm wondering about my tolerance to both kratom and S&V as it's really hard to gauge at this point since they're supposed to be synergistic and im blending them. I'm going to experiment and post my results, and start with a higher S&V usage and less kratom and see if that helps first, but i'm wondering if anyone else has a kind of weird relationship with kratom since taking it with S&V.

You say you're blending 50/50 stem and vein and kratom, but have you recently rotated to a batch that has stem and vein already in it?

So, most Indonesian suppliers remove the stem and vein before the leaves dry, however, have a look at the picture below of leaves drying. Notice that the stems and veins are still there. For most string dried batches, stem and vein is left in. In saying, if you're using a bunch of string dried batches, one would build tolerance quicker, as by weight, you'd already be consuming roughly 50/50 stem and vein mix in your regular powder. When you do a 75/25, you're actually getting close to 90% stem and vein, perhaps this is counter productive for your goals

I'd recommend asking your vendors if the batch already contains stem and vein, as this really seems like the issue IMHO.

[Mean Malay]

I dont understand why people dont just pop a new batch that they never had for tolerance breaks instead stem and vein. Reason i say is to get different alkaloid profiles and do it very low, .5 or 1g or 2g depending what your doses were. For example, if you been on 10 grams per day, take 1g early on the day then another 1g later on the day with a new batch or a batch you haven't done in a while and you know its good.

But aint stem and vein meant for tolerance breaks?? I think you mostly felt the kratom and very little from stem vein. But with kratom if breaks not taken tolerance always grows. so it grew to the point where not much felt especially adding stem vein you will feel barley anything. I would advice not mixing and sticking to stem veins when decide to take breaks or another option stop both of them, use something alternative and try again what you tried before.

no, it's not just the kratom i'm feeling. stem n vein (the right kind) has a distinct feel and euphoria to it. It is definitely different than plain leaf kratom.

[Mean Malay]

does anyone have any experience with this?

I first started taking stem n vein at higher doses to taper from plain leaf kratom, but decided to do a 50/50 S&V and kratom blend. i dose 5-6 grams 3X per day and wait 5-7 hours per dose. In the beginning, i got a really nice calm buzz from S&V. like a serene meditative state. I was taking much more stem n vein and less kratom, more like a 75/25 blend. That was less than 2 months ago and i don't feel that anymore since i've been doing the 50/50. I feel much shorter lasting burns and the calm mood isn't as prominent.

I'm left thinking i need to readjust my blend. Did the S&V overpower the kratom previously which is why i felt that way? Ever since i've been taking S&V, take only plain leaf kratom has feel weird in a bad way, so i've only used the S & V + kratom blend. I'm wondering about my tolerance to both kratom and S&V as it's really hard to gauge at this point since they're supposed to be synergistic and im blending them. I'm going to experiment and post my results, and start with a higher S&V usage and less kratom and see if that helps first, but i'm wondering if anyone else has a kind of weird relationship with kratom since taking it with S&V.

You say you're blending 50/50 stem and vein and kratom, but have you recently rotated to a batch that has stem and vein already in it?

So, most Indonesian suppliers remove the stem and vein before the leaves dry, however, have a look at the picture below of leaves drying. Notice that the stems and veins are still there. For most string dried batches, stem and vein is left in. In saying, if you're using a bunch of string dried batches, one would build tolerance quicker, as by weight, you'd already be consuming roughly 50/50 stem and vein mix in your regular powder. When you do a 75/25, you're actually getting close to 90% stem and vein, perhaps this is counter productive for your goals

I'd recommend asking your vendors if the batch already contains stem and vein, as this really seems like the issue IMHO.

even if i'm getting 90% stem and vein, then that's still lowering my tolerance to plain leaf kratom alkaloids to some degree then though...no? i'm just really confused now.

[fusedflora]

[/quote]even if i'm getting 90% stem and vein, then that's still lowering my tolerance to plain leaf kratom alkaloids to some degree then though...no? i'm just really confused now.[/quote]

Yes, but if you're doing 100% stem and vein, for a week, then move to 50/50 mix (that is string dried) that ends up being 90% stem and vein, then of course you're not going to feel much, as you're now tolerant to the stem and vein and likely overdoing it adding the more potent leafy parts.

Again, is what you call "plain leaf," just the leafy part, or is your vendor string drying it? Do you know? I would recommend asking them on your regular rotations, especially if using stem and vein, you'd want to know which ones already have it in it, because mixing the two just builds tolerance for both, rather than building tolerance for one while reducing the other, it's a balancing act.