Double M Herbals | Kratom Forum

*Updated to include sea cargo.

Hey everyone - I promised I would keep the community informed of any changes I become aware of regarding the supply lines of kratom. I want to emphasize that these updates do not mean that you need to begin hoarding a supply. Just use common sense and keep an eye on things.

It doesn't appear that things are cutting off, but it should be noted that lanes are beginning to be squeezed. Something we should all be keeping an eye out is how the decline of international travel might come into play because a lot of transcontinental freight/mail are carried on those planes. The following are a few of the developments that I have learned of as of yesterday.


DHL Malaysia - A common lane for unauthorized shipments is through DHL Malaysia - as of now, that appears to be shut down (this is the cheapest shipping avenue for exporters).



Air Cargo - No issues at this time.

POS - this is probably the most common means of shipping and there has been an imposed restriction of 500kg of cargo/packages per day. At first, I thought this was 500kg of kratom per supplier... then I thought it was 500kg of kratom period (for all suppliers)... now I have learned this is 500kg of total cargo (kratom and other goods). This is a very significant reduction. This is a bit of a problem...








Sea Cargo - Some of the biggest US importers use sea cargo (its very economical if you can fill a shipping container). It is looking like there are major issues there as well. https://gcaptain.com/shipping-container ... rt-supply/




I will continue to share as I get more information.

Well I'm stocked now, just in case

Please note I update my original post. There is a significant change in POS shipping that changes the picture dramatically.

gumbyke1 wrote:... now I have learned this is 500 kg of total cargo (kratom and other goods). This is a very significant reduction. This is a bit of a problem...

Alright, here we go... Yes if POS now has a daily limit. Things will slow down, for sure. Thanks for keeping us informed Gumby!

What's your sense of current stock on hand across the USA ?? I believe that overall, USA vendors are very well stocked right now.. Remember last November, was the 1st Nov in four years we did NOT have a 'Panic'.. so there's lots of kratom out there.

However, Small Batch/ backpack sellers are always.. about 20 kg away from being Sold Out. Right?? So there's that...

Thank you for keeping everyone updated, gumby!

BallzDeep9 wrote:

gumbyke1 wrote:... now I have learned this is 500 kg of total cargo (kratom and other goods). This is a very significant reduction. This is a bit of a problem...

Alright, here we go... Yes if POS now has a daily limit. Things will slow down, for sure. Thanks for keeping us informed Gumby!

What's your sense of current stock on hand across the USA ?? I believe that overall, USA vendors are very well stocked right now.. Remember last November, was the 1st Nov in four years we did NOT have a 'Panic'.. so there's lots of kratom out there.

However, Small Batch/ backpack sellers are always.. about 20 kg away from being Sold Out. Right?? So there's that...

I'm honestly not sure... I can only speak for us. Coincidently, before all of this we had stockpiled a ton of leaf just so that we would have our very best dry-season leaf to supplement the lower number of batches we think will qualify for our menu during the rainy season. However, even though were stocked to the gills, our stock is starting to thin out for sure.

My wife and I had to debate whether or not to end our special event early because if we keep going at our current sale-through rate we will certainly run out. However, we made the decision to remain open to this community because on the flip side of the coin... we dont know if eventually, all shipping will shut down. We dont want our valuable products to be collecting green dust on our storage shelves if the fine folks here could use it to prepare themselves for what may be ahead

The good thing is there are many more wholesale domestic suppliers than there were even just a few years ago. Because of the legal and financial risks involved with importing, many vendors have switched to supplying through domestic wholesalers. The only problems with a domestic supply are quality and price. In order to maintain any kind of profit margin, you have to charge higher prices than anyone here is willing to pay. Also, the quality is in line with any of the huge operations... its nothing like the vendors who are popular in these types of communities.

We have several small-batch vendors that buy our product for personal use, and a couple of them have inquired about making a bulk purchase. This is a red flag because it tells me they are probably running low and are projecting that the kratom prices will at some point raise enough for them to still make a profit.

I'm also hearing chatter that POS shipping cost has officially gone up considerably. Another source said that bribery now plays a role in deciding who gets to export. Both of these two things I hear from other vendors who are connected - I have not confirmed them with my Indonesian partner.


I'd be curious to hear from other vendors our there.... maybe Ben, Shaun, or Nick could chime in?

Thanks for keeping us informed !

Two weeks ago I would have never thought it could get this bad.

Same Marcussk. This just escalated so quickly. The decrease in international shipping volume is concerning but I suppose that a lot of vendors still have stuff on hand. Could be impactful a couple weeks down the road though.

Marcussk wrote:Two weeks ago I would have never thought it could get this bad.

Probably shouldn't say it but it's most likely going to get a lot worse before it gets better.

I am preparing for the worst and hoping for the best.

herbalhippie wrote:

Marcussk wrote:Two weeks ago I would have never thought it could get this bad.

Probably shouldn't say it but it's most likely going to get a lot worse before it gets better.

I am preparing for the worst and hoping for the best.

Hope for sunshine, but build dikes. Never thought I would live to see a day that the doomsday preppers have been ready for for years.

Marcussk wrote:

herbalhippie wrote:

Marcussk wrote:Two weeks ago I would have never thought it could get this bad.

Probably shouldn't say it but it's most likely going to get a lot worse before it gets better.

I am preparing for the worst and hoping for the best.

Hope for sunshine, but build dikes. Never thought I would live to see a day that the doomsday preppers have been ready for for years.

All these years my kids thought I was nutso. WHO'S LAUGHING NOW, HUH?

Updated to add sea cargo

gumbyke1 wrote: POS - this is probably the most common means of shipping and there has been an imposed restriction of 500kg of cargo/packages per day. At first, I thought this was 500kg of kratom per supplier... then I thought it was 500kg of kratom period (for all suppliers)... now I have learned this is 500kg of total cargo (kratom and other goods). This is a very significant reduction. This is a bit of a problem...

I can confirmed this is real info.
Yes, POS ( Pontianak ) just send to Jakarta 500kg/day.
Let's hope this thing will get better soon.
I will update every information from here *Pontianak*

herbalhippie wrote:

Marcussk wrote:Two weeks ago I would have never thought it could get this bad.

Probably shouldn't say it but it's most likely going to get a lot worse before it gets better.

I am preparing for the worst and hoping for the best.

Going for two metric s**t-tons? Haha! You've probably got enough leaf to rival half of the small batchers here!

As far as getting worse before it gets better, this could very well be the squeeze they are looking for. All they need is an inch and they will find a way to make it a mile. This is my biggest fear. There are many smart and equally evil people that are employed with the government in these organizations. They have or will think of every possibility and execute it because they have the resources to do so. I hope for each and every one of us that this isnt a catalyst to the grand plan of these slimebags that they've been looking/waiting for. Only time will tell...Good luck to all of you and just FYI, I read an article where a woman in Italy was interviewed and she said the storea REMAIN OPEN and it is allowed to go daily if necessary, so stocking to the gills isnt entirely necessary. I mean, prepare, but you won't starve IF Trump models his closure after the Italians, which it is said he will do. Also, I have no idea how credible the article is, just passing along the info. It is the media after all....Love you all and good luck. Things are about to get a little fucky.

gumbyke1 wrote:

BallzDeep9 wrote:

gumbyke1 wrote:... now I have learned this is 500 kg of total cargo (kratom and other goods). This is a very significant reduction. This is a bit of a problem...

Alright, here we go... Yes if POS now has a daily limit. Things will slow down, for sure. Thanks for keeping us informed Gumby!

What's your sense of current stock on hand across the USA ?? I believe that overall, USA vendors are very well stocked right now.. Remember last November, was the 1st Nov in four years we did NOT have a 'Panic'.. so there's lots of kratom out there.

However, Small Batch/ backpack sellers are always.. about 20 kg away from being Sold Out. Right?? So there's that...

I'm honestly not sure... I can only speak for us. Coincidently, before all of this we had stockpiled a ton of leaf just so that we would have our very best dry-season leaf to supplement the lower number of batches we think will qualify for our menu during the rainy season. However, even though were stocked to the gills, our stock is starting to thin out for sure.

My wife and I had to debate whether or not to end our special event early because if we keep going at our current sale-through rate we will certainly run out. However, we made the decision to remain open to this community because on the flip side of the coin... we dont know if eventually, all shipping will shut down. We dont want our valuable products to be collecting green dust on our storage shelves if the fine folks here could use it to prepare themselves for what may be ahead

The good thing is there are many more wholesale domestic suppliers than there were even just a few years ago. Because of the legal and financial risks involved with importing, many vendors have switched to supplying through domestic wholesalers. The only problems with a domestic supply are quality and price. In order to maintain any kind of profit margin, you have to charge higher prices than anyone here is willing to pay. Also, the quality is in line with any of the huge operations... its nothing like the vendors who are popular in these types of communities.

We have several small-batch vendors that buy our product for personal use, and a couple of them have inquired about making a bulk purchase. This is a red flag because it tells me they are probably running low and are projecting that the kratom prices will at some point raise enough for them to still make a profit.

I'm also hearing chatter that POS shipping cost has officially gone up considerably. Another source said that bribery now plays a role in deciding who gets to export. Both of these two things I hear from other vendors who are connected - I have not confirmed them with my Indonesian partner.


I'd be curious to hear from other vendors our there.... maybe Ben, Shaun, or Nick could chime in?

DHL is off limits for us (I don't want to go to prison LOL) and I can definitely tell you that POS has increased shipping costs by $3 per kg. We order almost weekly now, and it's been this way for a while. Considerable, but not detrimental and absolutely not enough for us to warrant passing the higher operating costs on to our customers.

I would also like to add, that our supplier has not heard anything bad about POS slowing down, or this talk about limits. They pick up our shipment the day after it's prepared, and it usually leaves Pontianak within 1 business day. I'll update everyone again on Monday, as our latest shipment was picked up Friday morning. I expect it to leave Pontianak Monday and get to San Francisco by Friday.

Thanks so much for passing on all this great info!
I cringe at the thought of not having leaf for pain control and appreciate your knowledge that helps me plan accordingly

Absolutely!! It's very important to us as well. I will post when it updates. I really don't comprehend this 500kg daily limit for POS? Much, much more than that leaves every single day.

LuckyHerbals wrote:Absolutely!! It's very important to us as well. I will post when it updates. I really don't comprehend this 500kg daily limit for POS? Much, much more than that leaves every single day.

Please let me know - gathering more information it looks like 500kg per agent. I am being told that this is about 1/4th of the normally allowed bandwidth.

Will do Chris! I will talk to him this evening.

Okay, so I got some more info. The airline that is responsible for transporting most of the kratom from Borneo, Aceh, etc to Jakarta is now limited to one flight per day (Garuda Airlines). This makes complete sense as there are travel restrictions and shelter in place orders in large cities of Indonesia... not too many people are flying. Basically, only what they can fit on that one flight is what is making it to Jakarta. From Jakarta, things seem to be okay.

I am also hearing there is now an 8-day hold before releasing at import (this does not have a major impact, vendors should be quarantining all imported packages regardless).

Again - this isnt a reason to start hoarding kratom. It looks like things are still getting through, its just a reduced pipeline at this point.

gumbyke1 wrote:Okay, so I got some more info. The airline that is responsible for transporting most of the kratom from Borneo, Aceh, etc to Jakarta is now limited to one flight per day (Garuda Airlines). This makes complete sense as there are travel restrictions and shelter in place orders in large cities of Indonesia... not too many people are flying. Basically, only what they can fit on that one flight is what is making it to Jakarta. From Jakarta, things seem to be okay.

I am also hearing there is now an 8-day hold before releasing at import (this does not have a major impact, vendors should be quarantining all imported packages regardless).

Again - this isnt a reason to start hoarding kratom. It looks like things are still getting through, its just a reduced pipeline at this point.

Too late, amigo! I've already started! Haha! I don't think there is a word in english to express how thankful I am for you being here. I don't know you in real life but you are quite obviously a super nice and super cool guy. Thank you. I'm sorry I'm so irresponsible about the tester thing. If it makes you feel better, I have at least a half kilo of various kratom I've been needing to send to c_c and I still haven't. I just hope you dont like me because of my obvious irresponsibility, however I understand if you do. I just suck about that stuff. I'm going to stop now. Fricking mushrooms! Haha!

TL;DR : We love you and appreciate you and I hope you know that.

Our shipment was picked up Friday, and just left Jakarta an hour ago.... business as usual. It will hit customs on Thursday. So far, no delays with POS for 3 weeks straight now...fingers crossed.

FROM THE USPS WEBSITE, CURRENT 3/23/20:

https://faq.usps.com/s/article/USPS-Cor ... -Customers

Note: this only applies to US mail, but includes receiving international shipments.

LuckyHerbals wrote:Our shipment was picked up Friday, and just left Jakarta an hour ago.... business as usual. It will hit customs on Thursday. So far, no delays with POS for 3 weeks straight now...fingers crossed.

Praying it stays this way man.. I have a ton of leaf but with all of the current FDA threats, I might just be stocking up on a bit more.. Scary times for sure.

*UPDATE*

SHIPMENT ARRIVED IN SAN FRANCISCO ON-SCHEDULE AND IS BEING PROCESSED BY US CUSTOMS.

Second shipment was picked up Wednesday and processed in Jakarta in same 24 hour period. Things seem to still be moving along smoothly folks.

Let me add that we only use POS for legality. The cost to ship is higher and adds $3 per kilo for us. We used DHL when Kratom was allowed, and I have to say that POS has been faster every time over the last year.

LuckyHerbals wrote:*UPDATE*

SHIPMENT ARRIVED IN SAN FRANCISCO ON-SCHEDULE AND IS BEING PROCESSED BY US CUSTOMS.

Second shipment was picked up Wednesday and processed in Jakarta in same 24 hour period. Things seem to still be moving along smoothly folks.

In and out of customs in 3 hours. This is great!!!

I just heard they just completely shut down shipping for POS indo. Do any of the vendors here know anything about this?

Marcussk wrote:I just heard they just completely shut down shipping for POS indo. Do any of the vendors here know anything about this?

Yeahh I saw that too...
Gumby, have you heard the same?

Marcussk wrote:I just heard they just completely shut down shipping for POS indo. Do any of the vendors here know anything about this?

I heard the same thing.
DHL is still shipping though.

Smokenfireball wrote:

Marcussk wrote:I just heard they just completely shut down shipping for POS indo. Do any of the vendors here know anything about this?

I heard the same thing.
DHL is still shipping though.

Yea but you have to smuggle it if you use DHL. Declare it as something else and hope for the best, which is a expensive risk to take.

Where are you guys hearing that? I can't find anything on any Indo news sites or on the Indo POS site itself.

Yes this is true they are stopping all international shipments with POS for 14 days. Stay tuned.

Yup - POS has suspended all shipments to TC1 due to Covid. (TC1 = Western Hemisphere).

LuckyHerbals wrote:Yes this is true they are stopping all international shipments with POS for 14 days. Stay tuned.

gumbyke1 wrote:Yup - POS has suspended all shipments to TC1 due to Covid. (TC1 = Western Hemisphere).

Thanks for weighing in on this guys. I'm praying for the small vendors that they can survive through this time of uncertainty.

So, how quickly do you think vendors will run out of stock here? A week? Two weeks? I have enough for a month, but I can't order any until next week... Trying to figure out how much I need to cut down, if at all.

dimmitree wrote:So, how quickly do you think vendors will run out of stock here? A week? Two weeks? I have enough for a month, but I can't order any until next week... Trying to figure out how much I need to cut down, if at all.

It's hard to say for sure, It just depends on how much they keep "on hand". There are still ways to get kratom in, its just things are getting more difficult. However, I would NOT put yourself in a bad financial situation to buy kratom. In the event that the well runs dry, it will still be a while before vendors run out. I am going to go ahead and try to get more in now - I have a few tricks up my sleeve. I will let you guys know if I am successful.

Either way, TFH still has a ton of stock... I mean a ridiculous amount. Coincidently we imported massive amounts of stock during November/December with the intention of having it to last us through the rainy season. If anyone is concerned with being able to get some - dont be. I can guarantee that TFH has plenty of stock and will be opening our doors again soon exclusively to the Double M community. I can promise this community that we have plenty of stock that will last a good bit, anyone who wishes to purchase from us will be able to at least through the rest of April and probably May (this is if we dont get any more stock in, which I think we will be able to). I will be transparent and I will give several weeks of advance notice if it looks like we are in danger of running out.

YOU DO NOT NEED TO PANIC BUY - I would be 100% honest if I thought you did.