Double M Herbals | Kratom Forum

I am siting here and wondering about all the kratomites who use 8 grams daily or more. As snow storms sweep the USA, some wont even be able to get out of the house if snowed in and what if your body gives up on kratom and your forced to cold turkey. Like kidney or liver goes bad. Does everyone have a plan ready to go? Do you have supply to measure sugar or blood pressure? Do you have the vitamins? I mean if you take breaks every week you will survive but those who are everyday users will need help. This post is awareness to be ready. So if anyone wish to share their plans to help others out, this is the place.

This are the tools i think that are very important
- Sugar level machine
- Blood Pressure Machine
- Vitamins - Vit C - Vit D - Iodine - etc
- A bag of Chamomile tea (from Egypt) < It is best go too to do soft detox from kratom and also helps sleep well. Might be enough to get by trough cold turkey in case of emergency. It can be drunk until you feel somewhat stable.

I mean the list can go, what will be your go too? And longest days you went with no kratom?

brave777 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 13, 2021 3:00 pm
This are the tools i think that are very important
- Sugar level machine
- Blood Pressure Machine
- Vitamins - Vit C - Vit D - Iodine - etc
- A bag of Chamomile tea (from Egypt) < It is best go too to do soft detox from kratom and also helps sleep well. Might be enough to get by trough cold turkey in case of emergency. It can be drunk until you feel somewhat stable.

I mean the list can go, what will be your go too? And longest days you went with no kratom?

What is the sugar and blood pressure machine useful for ? To monitor physical affects during a detox?

I wouldn't mind having some clonidine on hand and maybe a few benzo's, . That has helped in the past and would be a way to regulate blood pressure. From what I have read I think Agmatine would also be helpful , for a fast taper or maybe even for an abrupt stop .

People swear by the Wim Hof Method. https://www.wimhofmethod.com/breathing-exercises. I haven't spent that much time on the breathing exercises but I know the cold water thing creates a huge dopamine release that can be helpful in acute situations.

L-theanine, magnesium, Valerian, and melatonin for help with sleep, as well as the chamomile, I didn't know Egyptian chamomile was best I am going to look into it. I have CBD gummies with melatonin , as long as they are used sparingly they work pretty well. Maybe Kava

I have heard that gabapentin is useful, no experience though .

If the list gets too long it's just confusing and there are probably interactions that aren't helpful.

to be honest I have had the easiest time just using very small doses of Buprenorphine for 2 or 3 days. But that's pretty hard for me to source - it's really not worth the trouble for me and it's probably overkill.

I have had to take some pretty long breaks a couple times over the last 5 years. A couple times by choice , but mostly not. I took three months off kratom last summer because I didn't know if my probation was going to be ok with it . I kept putting it off and then just went cold turkey the week before I went in for my first piss test. It wasn't that bad really. Low energy and motivation for a week. I took a long weekend the first 3 days and wrapped up on the couch with a bunch of movies - thats more force of habit than anything , that was my go to method for opiate withdrawal . I quit phenibut around the same time and I am never taking that shit again . After it became clear that probation didn't care I started taking kratom again. My plan these days is to just have enough stashed that a year or two interruption in the supply won't be a problem. The only reason I would ever have to stop except for t breaks is if I did start having kidney or liver problems. That would really be a shame.

DittonW wrote: ↑Sat Feb 13, 2021 5:16 pm What is the sugar and blood pressure machine useful for ? To monitor physical affects during a detox?

Well if you took kratom with no breaks for a long time 1 year or 5 years strait with no break. Your body is dependent on it and you would not know how to act, so if stop kratom the blood pressure might sky rocket and you might end up in emergency room. When you can hook up blood pressure machine and see if its over 130, if it hits close to 170 or even 150. Blood pressure meds or herbs that lower it need to be used or you wont sleep and go crazy. And people near by friends or family might give you wrong advice that might get you in hospital for sure. And blood sugar if to low can also give issues to health. Its just when you stop kratom after long use, body is seeking those Mitra effects cause its thinking it has to be that way but its not finding it. Also blood pressure machines most times not so accurate so dont cheap out and try get best one and measure it at least 3 times to see if its actually high. Someone can correct me if i am wrong but thats how i see it. You can also monitor detox with it, like if you get dizzy spells and very unmotivated and to the point when your confused, check blood pressure right away. Also dont cheap out on blood pressure meds, i mean their is natural onces and over the counter, just do the research and get it ahead of time. If you wait last minute and you snowed in and cant get to pharmacy, research right away what lower blood pressure and what in kitchen you can use. You might have it in front of your nose the whole time but since your so scared to take anything to make it worse you wont take anything and might end up on the floor. People dont understand that everyday kratom use is not a good thing. Its meant only when you cant take the pain anymore or when you need a small boost and even 1 gram will give that boost. No need to do 3 grams or 6 grams, its just asking for trouble over long use and everyday. Especially these days when people are afraid to go to hospitals to catch rona. That's just my personal thought but always if can call your doctor or someone who is very experienced and worked in the field if can.

Oh I use From Egyt Chamomiles. They smell and taste better from my personal experience, oh and more effective over any other brand. It is awesome https://www.amazon.com/Starwest-Botanic ... e5153e81cb

I honestly think doing it CT with some Gabapentin, hot showers and comfort food is best. If you can get Gabapentin that is. It is the best for RLS. Trazadone is also a great sleep aide and non habit forming. Most Dr's will prescribe it. If you are concerned with vitamins, I'd get a multi vitamin from a place like Sprouts and use that. Loperamide would be be good, too. If you suffer from diarrhea. Don't take too much though. You'd have to take a ton, but loperamide can help with withdrawals a whole lot but it will also destroy your tolerance if you take it for that. Definitely best to keep it for your bowels only.

Withdrawals are different for everyone of course but the time I did have some from lack of Kratom they weren't horrible and didn't put me into any danger. But I didn't have to worry about my BP back back then. By day 4 I was feeling quite normal. Just a note though, I had yet to experience withdrawals from other stuff yet so for me it seemed pretty bad. But looking back on it, it would be a walk in the park now compared to some other stuff. Not trying to tell a War Story or sound like a tough guy. Just want you to know that Kratom withdrawal is definitely manageable. The stuff I saw on Reddit about Kratom Withdrawals floored me. It was absolutely absurd. I literally read one guy say "I took any drug I could get my hands on" then turned around and blamed Kratom for his seizures and hospitalizations.

brave777 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 14, 2021 2:58 am
Well if you took kratom with no breaks for a long time 1 year or 5 years strait with no break. Your body is dependent on it and you would not know how to act, so if stop kratom the blood pressure might sky rocket and you might end up in emergency room.

And people near by friends or family might give you wrong advice that might get you in hospital for sure.

TLDR - r/quittingphenibut convinced me I needed to go the emergency room and the whole thing was a shit show. also, I make poor decisions.
                                                       
This is really embarrassing but I don't care. I mentioned that I quit taking phenibut around the same time I took my last break from kratom. It was actually quite a few months before that. I took it on the advised schedule for a long time , 3 days on 4 days off, until I didn't. I was taking 2 or 3 grams a day for a while. Like six months. So, I quit , on a Friday or a Saturday . On Sunday I started feeling pretty peakish and I GOT ON REDDIT and asked r/quittingphenibut for advice. Which was a terribly foolish thing to do . They told me "your blood pressure could go through the roof , it's so dangerous. I can't believe you just quit cold turkey. you could die" !

So I checked my blood pressure and it was at 130 , which I thought was high, but I was also going into a panic attack from , everything. . r/quittingphenibut was all telling me I needed to go to the hospital. TBH I would not have gone except I was just not thinking clearly at this point. And , I was thinking , what if I do pass out and my kid is the only one here to deal with it?

I had to go to the emergency room because it was sunday .
When they checked my blood pressure at the hospital it was already down to 120, I think just because I wasn't having a panic attack anymore. And then they gave me some benzos and I was fine. BUT THEN, they told me my electrolyte levels were dangerously low, or some shit, and that I needed to stay in the hospital overnight. I was like "no way" what am I going to do with my kid while I'm resorting it up in a hospital bed? So I pulled all the monitoring stuff off the they had on me, and I was like "Sorry, got to go "

But as I was walking out the door the DR was yelling at me ."You could die! think of how your son would feel if you drop over dead! this is a really serious situation"!. So I took my kid to his moms and went back to the hospital and they did whatever test they did before. - electrolytes or whatever. And they said " Hmmm, these levels really aren't that bad, they could have just been low because you were having a panic attack" , but you should probably stay overnight anyway ". They switched me off to another DR because the original one was so mad at me for walking out on him in the middle of him yelling at me about how I was going to die.

So I stayed there overnight and all they did was a fluids IV that I could have just handled at home with pedialyte. Completely unnecessary . And to this day they send me a monthly $7000 bill that (edit) I finally came to terms with and called them about and got on a plan to pay it off, but I just threw it into the trash for a long time because I was so mad.

That first emergency room Dr was mad from the very beginning because when I came in I showed a paper that r/quittingphenibut told me to print off and take to the emergency room. I said," blah blah blah blah. read this. I need benzo's and baclafen ." he threw the paper in the garbage and then went and googled phenibut and came back in and said " I'm going to prescribe you some benzo's and baclefen", as if I hadn't just told him that. I really do suspect that at least part of the whole "low fluids and overnight stay" deal was because he was mad about my internet self diagnosis and trying to stick me with a bill. It worked !

lessons learned: Do not take medical advice from Reddit.
Don't self diagnose and tell Doctors what the prescription should be. It makes them really angry.
Have a plan - see I tied it back into the topic of this thread.

Having no plan can get you a huge bill when you could of stocked up and paid way less of everything you needed in a first place. My friend went in and they didn't do anything and she came out in same state feeling and they billed her 10,000 ridiculous. She had to go to someone who knew what they were doing and it took care of all her problems for dirt cheap. Its sad but its big money grab from the people. over night for some fluids for 7,000 is insane. This just proves you have to get ready while you feel great instead last minute when you end up with a big bill. But you are right, kratom WD is not harsh, it can be only if forced cold turkey from a big dose and everyday use for years. But if breaks are in place you know exactly what to do and what steps to take each break. I always wondered about phenibut and never tried it seeing many harsh wd comments. I am sure it has its use.

One guy made a post that he swore weed would stop any & all wd from kratom.

Me personally - the longest I stopped was 4 weeks. I tried melatonin & Benedryl to help out. I took gobs & gobs of Benedryl to try & stop my severe anxiety. It was like using bubble gum to repair a hole in a dam. I did have a BP gauge & metoprolol. Metoprolol did not help at all. Neither did the BP gauge.

I quit for tolerance breaks all the time and never have any serious symptoms. Maybe a little bit aggravated/anxious and a runny nose. Then again, I'm down to taking maybe 10g per day total. I can imagine if someone is well over 20 gpd, it may be a bit rougher. Plus, everyone is different. Some people get bad withdrawal from quitting anything, and others simply don't. I feel a lot of it is more mental than physical. You psyche yourself up to expect the worst.

I'll you what I did have issues with though - nicotine. I don't smoke but I chew tobacco and I tried to seriously quit one time. After 48 hours, I found myself at the gas station buying a can because of the headache and absolutely MONSTROUS cravings. I was so aggravated and pissed off at the world, snapping at everyone and everything. Nicotine is probably one of the hardest substances to quit. I used to be a heavy drinker and quitting drinking for 2 years was easier than trying to go 2 days without nicotine. Kratom is way more manageable to quit compared to nicotine/alcohol.

DittonW wrote: ↑Sun Feb 14, 2021 3:21 pmDo not take medical advice from Reddit.

TBH, don't take any advice from reddit. People will BS out their ass and type anything for upvotes because anyone can claim to be an "expert". I've seen some horrible advice being dished out there, for almost everything including finances, legal advice, home flipping, medical advice, etc. It's a good site for memes and some of the smaller hobby subs are good, but not so much for anything that requires serious advice.