Vendors offering "free" samples

[Kelleytoons]

So today I got suckered into clicking on a vendor here offering "free" samples - but of course it was nothing of the sort ($4 for shipping is NOT free in my book).

I think such vendors are shooting themselves in the foot. Either that or they are selling crap (and know it). If they have good stuff then folks WILL buy it with ACTUAL free samples (I had to fill out a six question questionnaire and that alone would have proved my seriousness). As it is - they've lost a customer who would have spent hundreds if they had good stuff.

It's hard to stand out - but advertising something as free when it isn't is one of the lowest forms of scams (I get that all the time on FB and in scam emails "FREE this and FREE that - only pay shipping. Yeah, that ain't free).

[NiqueKristan]

So today I got suckered into clicking on a vendor here offering "free" samples - but of course it was nothing of the sort ($4 for shipping is NOT free in my book).

I think such vendors are shooting themselves in the foot. Either that or they are selling crap (and know it). If they have good stuff then folks WILL buy it with ACTUAL free samples (I had to fill out a six question questionnaire and that alone would have proved my seriousness). As it is - they've lost a customer who would have spent hundreds if they had good stuff.

It's hard to stand out - but advertising something as free when it isn't is one of the lowest forms of scams (I get that all the time on FB and in scam emails "FREE this and FREE that - only pay shipping. Yeah, that ain't free).

IMO the samples are free. Shipping is not. Not every vendor can afford to both give out free product and pay for shipping. I think that’s a bit unreasonable to call out vendors for that. Many vendors don’t offer free samples at all!

[Kelleytoons]

As long as they SAY that - but in this case it did not say that at all. Not until I clicked the link in the email, not until I wasted my time filling out the questionnaire, not until I then copied the password they gave me and clicked ANOTHER link they gave me, and added the pack to the cart and THEN checked out did it tell me I owed $4.

That's a scam.

[onespeedstop]

I kind of agree, but with shipping costs rising/having risen these days, it's a pretty big ask. That said, free samples & free shipping would set a very positive vibe with potential customers. But imagine doing that on FB, you'd be sending out thousands of samples a day, the cost would up very very fast. But yeah, hiding the shipping charge til the end is shady, just say it up front and let people decide if it's worth it to them.

[Kelleytoons]

That's all I wanted - the post here could have just said "Samples for $4" and then I wouldn't have even bothered responding. At my age I'm pretty sensitive to the fact that money will not buy you even one more second of life.

(The other thing that really bothered me was that there was no way of knowing the sample size - it showed three bags with no writing anywhere to indicate and nothing in the description. I *might* have paid $4 for, say, 25 grams each, but I honestly don't need to fool around with anything less than that nowadays unless I see a GREAT review here and for all I know there might have only been 10 grams in each bag).

[WhiteAngelica]

Kratom Krates offers free samples and they are wildly generous, 3 1oz packages with free shipping. Not sure if you knew...

[Kelleytoons]

Never heard of them - and as a rule unless they are on "the list" I don't bother (actually, I don't bother unless I read a great review here).

There are SO many places I have to be discriminating nowadays (for example - even with "free" samples I need to take the time to make capsules, which is a LOT of my precious time. So I have to weigh carefully when I'm actually going to try this or not. As a rule I just don't bother).

[Badgame85]

I see your point and in the past I have has free samples that were COMPLETELY free, and then plenty with "just pay shipping." Honestly, a couple times in years past I have received a couple free kilos as samples from Indo direct Vendors and didn't pay a cent for it. So I know the inclusion or non-inclusion of shipping costs when considering free samples can kind of be a pain point.

HOWEVER I paid the shipping cost to get some of Sakti's free samples based on some recommendations. Boy was I glad I did! That sample pack is well worth the shipping cost if not 3x more. So sometimes you get shafted on shipping for junk, and sometimes you get a much higher benefit than what you thought you were getting.

Transparency is key, and I agree even something in parenthesis under the free sample language would be nice and honest to see though!

[Kelleytoons]

I think we agree on the basics.

(And as for Sakti's - I just bought the kilo of the three from him based on people's reports. And was SO glad I did - all three are wonderful).

[kwest13]

I think we agree on the basics.

(And as for Sakti's - I just bought the kilo of the three from him based on people's reports. And was SO glad I did - all three are wonderful).

I was very glad I paid the $5 shipping for Sakti's. Very good stuff. What is the vendor that was trying to charge you $4 for shipping? I would pay shipping for that vendor if it looks good.

[Kelleytoons]

I had never heard of this vendor before - which is ANOTHER thing. If a vendor isn't on "the list" and isn't well known around here you'd think that, as a first post (I think it was just his first) that said "free samples" he really would have meant that. Getting a customer list from this forum would be golden for any vendor not established.

In any case, I've completely erased them from my mind. I doubt whether their stuff is any good.

[Badgame85]

I think we agree on the basics.

(And as for Sakti's - I just bought the kilo of the three from him based on people's reports. And was SO glad I did - all three are wonderful).

Jesus... I don't NEED anymore Kratom lol... but your hooking me Kelleytoons! I only tried the white and green from the Sakti so far but now I'm thinking I need to cash in on some of those batches, because I agree they were good. I didn't get blown away from either (still very pleasant though) but you know when you find something reasonable or better, you gotta jump on it lol

[WhiteAngelica]

I know of other vendors with free samples, if you are interested. They even paid shipping.

[Kelleytoons]

Jesus... I don't NEED anymore Kratom lol... but your hooking me Kelleytoons! I only tried the white and green from the Sakti so far but now I'm thinking I need to cash in on some of those batches, because I agree they were good. I didn't get blown away from either (still very pleasant though) but you know when you find something reasonable or better, you gotta jump on it lol

Wait - do ANY of us here really need any MORE Kratom? Honestly, at my age (very, very old - that's not a cartoon, that's a picture of me) I will never live long enough to use all I have. And yet I continue to buy more. I'm pretty sure my grandkids will get a BIG surprise when they start going through my estate ("What the heck is this 'Okie's White Borneo', mom?")

My biggest problem right now is I am on Denette's membership (so - will buy lots there) AND there are so many truly great batches coming out from folks like Okie's, Treasure House and Sakti. And now I find out what we are *just* entering into the "good" season? Yipes - I am SO screwed.

[fusedflora]

we've always had free samples.... but we ask that it be a one time thing... We have had folks abuse it; sad but true. I mean,we certainly want to help those in need, and hold regular give aways, but why try to take advantage? It's much easier to let folks know, "hey, I need help." We all have vices, and can relate, but we have limits to what we can do feasibly.

Free means free to me.... I mean, most samples are the left overs from bagging, so paying for shipping is really negligible. I know vendors do it different, but we try to be transparent, it's a marketing expense for us.. if you stand by your product, let it stand for itself.

edit: we typically only get to send sample one day a week due to bagging schedules.

[Transformato]

So today I got suckered into clicking on a vendor here offering "free" samples - but of course it was nothing of the sort ($4 for shipping is NOT free in my book).

I think such vendors are shooting themselves in the foot. Either that or they are selling crap (and know it). If they have good stuff then folks WILL buy it with ACTUAL free samples (I had to fill out a six question questionnaire and that alone would have proved my seriousness). As it is - they've lost a customer who would have spent hundreds if they had good stuff.

It's hard to stand out - but advertising something as free when it isn't is one of the lowest forms of scams (I get that all the time on FB and in scam emails "FREE this and FREE that - only pay shipping. Yeah, that ain't free).

Use a coupon for free gum. You'll be charged tax for the gum you didn't have to pay for in some cases.
That's not a scam. It's legally required.

I saw that - a post I think. I knew I had to pay USPS but I don't remember why. I paid it on one of two other packs I was sent in the past 2 months. ONe covered the shipping.... the one that's a spin off brand of Happy Hippo. He used to ramble on about the profit margin on supplements on a blog he writes that's partly a feeder to HH. Say wealthy. I was ready to go on that sampler but was increasingly aware that I was not interested in buying from them later - them in particular for some reason - I think it was more gougy than the others.
The survey sealed the deal. - I didn't want to talk about me. So after setting up an account and the samples., I bailed lol.


but Here's what I think I"m catching.... not about "wrong" it's - something else is under your skin- & maybe like me right now, been delaying self care or just fatigued. I havent' bothered to eat more than nasty salty garbage with ... butter. Once again.. salty fried corn chips - and butter. For almost 24 hours. Whatever bad happens - it's gonna be on whom? yea. Puttin on coffee, shoes, for the cinnamon role they're holding for me at the Shell station across the street. sigh...

Folks I've been holding a delemma for about 12 days. Grit that's under your skin -does what? It amplifies. so I can relate to KToons here bc I'm primed for a rant that is my right to have- and I will not give future group owners or any other entity the power to take that away from me for fear of disapproval. This isn't a job interview and I don't let them access my social media or scrotum either. It wold be an exhausting explanation. I'd have to field a torrent of disbelief. I'd look bad for potentially hurting someones business after they put me in this position- which is - do I warn consumers or do I do what consumers do now- which is support their branded tribe and praise , only praise the clean room they walk into. edit- clean it up ha,, heck no. It's for KT Pay post offce the 4 bucks and get your samples man. You deserve them. Perspective - I haven't opened all of the crap but 3 that's 450g but I lost 70 seven zero dollars. get ur samps. please.

I tried everyting many times , 3 flavors that are useless. No I do this 3x daily for 6 years this has Never Happened Yes I have had things not "hit" at first and thing taht are not "right for me' but I can fix all of it.
everyting else works both before and after, I had enough waterand everything worked before and after, blends and brands and kinds and fast and slow and everyting beside push a 50 up my bung hole.
If it does anything for anyone- it's placebo and they figured it out by now but the most they'll do for you is say "Philly's greens don't hit for me" or similar. I think they send out good stuff til it's gone and then slide anything in it's place - bc YLYL isn't going to sell out of anything. Doubt me? Consider I just X'd my name out of every private group that emerges her on and maybe lose some I'm in now. LIability reasons. Surveillance. Suppression. It's oppression. And if you practice or support that fuck you. No seriously eat my ass. This is somethign that needed to come up too. The forums - ok 1. sell advertising 2. well they used to be for helping ppl with hard hardships help each other navigate a difficult market. No that's not what's going on now guys. Also notice Soc. media influencer culture has rooted & is thriving. If you really saw it, you'd know you don't want it. O'er on Reddeddit New subs named after search terms. 40 moderators? Many are sales associates, som janitors, they follow you and clean up your contribution after you leave the room if it leave a print on their surreal utopia where it's so - only nice and helpful. btw the free samples there are usuallly links given to affiliate marketers that are legally required to INFORM YOU of their relationship with the merchant. The do not. "They are amateurs. If FTC comes calling, they be forever financially ruined unless they are far more industrious than they are.

It's GONE! No more imposition up under my skin. PK - if I had recd this sub sub sub standard garbage when I was unable to walk. I would not have found out that I could have. God only knows where I'd be now if anywhere. I said "check your inventory". So who got to check their inventory?

[Lokey]

Well a little confused here...

but if I were to rant today it is this: Last night I ordered from a vendor that advertises free shipping $50 or more. I never heard of them or ordered from them before (Tusk) but they had the best deal on gummies I could find. I selected my items which totaled over $50. I noticed a place to enter coupon codes and decided to Google codes and actually found some and put one in and it actually worked! The total still said over $50 so I thought I was good, the screen did NOT show me that it was only over $50 because after the discount I fell below $50 and they added $4.99 flat rate mail charge. Had I seen that before I checked out I mightve added another product to stay over $50. I just felt a little cheated, they should've shown the shipping charge added before I finalized the order, I would've added something like another jar of gummies, if there's a way to avoid paying shipping I will. I was about $2 short.

[Kelleytoons]

I know what you mean about shipping - it just seems stupid, particularly when you spend a lot (I rarely order less than $100 from anyone, although it depends on how good the stuff is).

The other thing I used to hate was those sites that gave you "discounts" you accumulated by purchases but then would only allow you to use either the discount OR the sale price. So if they had, say, 20% off but you had spent hundreds with them (accumulating, say, $10 or so) you could choose one or the other. Luckily that was a big vendor I will never frequent again but you get the idea.

[BallzDeep9]

One covered the shipping.... the one that's a spin off brand of Happy Hippo. He used to ramble on about the profit margin on supplements on a blog he writes that's partly a feeder to HH. Say wealthy. I was ready to go on that sampler but was increasingly aware that I was not interested in buying from them later - them in particular for some reason - I think it was more gougy than the others.

Yup. Profiteers. Scammers. Price gougers. Professional Internet Trolls, who engage in multiple "Scam and Spam" methods, SEO and more... to steer the ingnorant, the curious and the Noobs - To a website then offer some Sales Pitch promotion... it's NOT about the Kratom. It's Entrepreneurs with degrees in Marketing - using Kratom since it's Grey Market and nobody knows anything about it. Manipulating Google with "Cute Funny Animals"

Free Samples = the old "Puppy Dog Close" which is, a well known Sales Pitch that almost ALWAYS results in getting their Money -- Goes like this. Oh LOOK at our Cute Puppies! Don't you really really want one? (Customer is not sure, uhh probably not ?) OK - here - Tell you what we'll DO - we'll GIVE you this nice Puppy, to take home for a few days. IF you decide you DON'T want the Puppy just bring him back. "Fair Enough" ?

Another TERM from the Golden Days of Florida Telemarketing, how to Sell anything to anyone and... Separate them from their Money... HOOK someone on something FREE. Do a "Test Close" to see IF, the Rube is going to fall for this... IF the Rube takes the "Free offer", they are considered - a Mooch. - A sucker who'll fall for any bullshit, IF you dangle some little offer to Close the Deal. Mooch falls for the Free Shipping - but pays double or triple for the merchandise lol

[Transformato]

Well a little confused here...

but if I were to rant today it is this: Last night I ordered from a vendor that advertises free shipping $50 or more. I never heard of them or ordered from them before (Tusk) but they had the best deal on gummies I could find. I selected my items which totaled over $50. I noticed a place to enter coupon codes and decided to Google codes and actually found some and put one in and it actually worked! The total still said over $50 so I thought I was good, the screen did NOT show me that it was only over $50 because after the discount I fell below $50 and they added $4.99 flat rate mail charge. Had I seen that before I checked out I mightve added another product to stay over $50. I just felt a little cheated, they should've shown the shipping charge added before I finalized the order, I would've added something like another jar of gummies, if there's a way to avoid paying shipping I will.

And a worthy rant if you were to come out and do it. Confusing was part of the risk & Yea it's confusing to me too. I didn't paint the big picture very well. It's not a clear situation- or like things that seem similar.
Coupon Codes- Yea I've had that happen and it really trips the wire. Little things? yea but no. Like the postage rant, it might be about something else. - conflicting messages if I must mention just one part of it.
Combining codes is a "sometimes" thing, usually no. It's like the site reached into the cookie jar and felt another hand in there & !! Just say no it thinks lol. The other hand is an affiliate but a professional "deal" site that gets a commision for sending customers. You were already at the door. That should be clear though - ideally on the seller ws, not relying on Terms & Service or some tiny print someone wants to downplay so you won't slow down and think. There used to be a thing - like a virtue, called "good business". Amateurs don't know jack about business or even how to sell It's NOT getting you to do what they want using tactics. All that bs does is make it harder and harder and harder to do business as either a merchant or customer.

[Loveandpeace]

This is a nice quick read germane to the convo.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/16/tech/dar ... index.html

[Transformato]

One covered the shipping.... the one that's a spin off brand of Happy Hippo. He used to ramble on about the profit margin on supplements on a blog he writes that's partly a feeder to HH. Say wealthy. I was ready to go on that sampler but was increasingly aware that I was not interested in buying from them later - them in particular for some reason - I think it was more gougy than the others.

Yup. Profiteers. Scammers. Price gougers. Professional Internet Trolls, who engage in multiple "Scam and Spam" methods, SEO and more... to steer the ingnorant, the curious and the Noobs - To a website then offer some Sales Pitch promotion... it's NOT about the Kratom. It's Entrepreneurs with degrees in Marketing - using Kratom since it's Grey Market and nobody knows anything about it. Manipulating Google with "Cute Funny Animals"

Free Samples = the old "Puppy Dog Close" which is, a well known Sales Pitch that almost ALWAYS results in getting their Money -- Goes like this. Oh LOOK at our Cute Puppies! Don't you really really want one? (Customer is not sure, uhh probably not ?) OK - here - Tell you what we'll DO - we'll GIVE you this nice Puppy, to take home for a few days. IF you decide you DON'T want the Puppy just bring him back. "Fair Enough" ?

Another TERM from the Golden Days of Florida Telemarketing, how to Sell anything to anyone and... Separate them from their Money... HOOK someone on something FREE. Do a "Test Close" to see IF, the Rube is going to fall for this... IF the Rube takes the "Free offer", they are considered - a Mooch. - A sucker who'll fall for any bullshit, IF you dangle some little offer to Close the Deal. Mooch falls for the Free Shipping - but pays double or triple for the merchandise lol

Waaay way back in my - gotta get a job, any job - days, (o m g where did the years go?) I got - yep a telemarketing job but get this.
I was in Dallas Tx and samples of a newspaper were being delivered for free (and unsolicited) to homes in a distant suburb. So the ppl didn't know why these rags were showing up in the yard.
A test pilot of.... The New York Times South West addition. Pffffff Yes it was / may even still be a Real Thing but I doubt it. Oddly, I sold some in spurts. For the same reason... the fashion section. Transplants from the North missed the NYT. But otherwise You Know - how that went down..
"I don't want no damn Yankee paper!" I was like 20 y o I think.
Curse of the mean lady - "You are going to fail." <pause> "You are a terrible sales person, a failure and you are not going to amount to anything"
Everyone remembers this kind of stuff for the rest of their life, don't they?
"I keep having to walk out there to pick up this trash and throw it away"
me- Hey, but think about it... It's morning, you're having your coffee... and isn't it nice - just knowing that it's there? (almost chokes laughing)
ding! One moment, my supervisor will be on the line to confirm your order

[Lokey]

I will say I got the gummies FAST, they were at my front door today and were convenient to take to work this afternoon and they taste strong, therefore not as tasty as the less potent ones which makes it easier not to take too many, just wish my $5 went towards an extra packet instead of the shipping! I just placed a 2nd order and got 4 packets and free shipping...yay

[WhiteAngelica]

To be frank, your demands are high. You want free samples of kratom wherein postage is covered and they must be on 'the list' which usually occupies between 12-20 vendors.

There are vendors out there with free samples as they try to establish themselves. Why would a vendor that is already on 'the list' need to offer free, postage paid samples? For what?

I think there are several vendors now offering free samples and eating the cost. It sounds like though, they don't meet your quality standards.

Maybe place an order from an established vendor on 'the list' and request samples with your purchase. Otherwise, you'll be hard pressed to find a vendor on 'the list' offering free samples, including postage.

[WhiteAngelica]

Jesus... I don't NEED anymore Kratom lol... but your hooking me Kelleytoons! I only tried the white and green from the Sakti so far but now I'm thinking I need to cash in on some of those batches, because I agree they were good. I didn't get blown away from either (still very pleasant though) but you know when you find something reasonable or better, you gotta jump on it lol

Wait - do ANY of us here really need any MORE Kratom? Honestly, at my age (very, very old - that's not a cartoon, that's a picture of me) I will never live long enough to use all I have. And yet I continue to buy more. I'm pretty sure my grandkids will get a BIG surprise when they start going through my estate ("What the heck is this 'Okie's White Borneo', mom?")

My biggest problem right now is I am on Denette's membership (so - will buy lots there) AND there are so many truly great batches coming out from folks like Okie's, Treasure House and Sakti. And now I find out what we are *just* entering into the "good" season? Yipes - I am SO screwed.

I wish I had your problems. Yes, some of us are living on disability and need more kratom because it is a luxury. I am honored to receive free samples because sometimes that has been the difference between unbridled chronic pain and actually being able to functionally shower. I know there have to be other folks like me. I mean, I'm hear for the voyeurism and I like to pray pretend that I can afford a dingleberry from a llamas ass, but rent blew up, grocery costs blew up, med costs blew up and I'm a Crip that considers free samples a great charity and my reviews, returns on that. I am trying to find the words for the find folks at Nature's Cure for example, but how unbiased can I be when they took away my pain? Sorry about all this. But I think there is this understanding that everyone here has doomsday piles and have FOMO and try all the new vendors...I just parrot the good things I hear and try to participate in the culture when I can. But I lost everything. And I do want people to have fun and luxuriate, just as I would have once done, before I got sick and lost my career. Kratom and Disability life are not comfortable bedfellows and if the doc offers me opiates, the insurance will cover that. I'd be a fool to keep trying to get through a month otherwise.

Sorry. Hit an emotional nerve. It's not you, but me. In no way am I looking for handouts, but kratom krates were so kind with their samples and I thought the quality was quite good. Does it compare to D? Probably not, but I'm never going to try his stuff in this lifetime. Kratom Krates and other vendors with samplers not on 'the list' has helped me. Just sayin' that there are people like me here...but probably not for long.

[Roofdog]

As long as they SAY that - but in this case it did not say that at all. Not until I clicked the link in the email, not until I wasted my time filling out the questionnaire, not until I then copied the password they gave me and clicked ANOTHER link they gave me, and added the pack to the cart and THEN checked out did it tell me I owed $4.

That's a scam.

If you really want free and truly free samples. Usually if you email a vendor personally, they will send you a couple strains that you think you will like. In return you should review them with a thumbs up or thumbs down. Shipping isnt cheap and for them to cover that is a gift.

[add to descartes]

Wait - do ANY of us here really need any MORE Kratom? Honestly, at my age (very, very old - that's not a cartoon, that's a picture of me) I will never live long enough to use all I have. And yet I continue to buy more. I'm pretty sure my grandkids will get a BIG surprise when they start going through my estate ("What the heck is this 'Okie's White Borneo', mom?")

My biggest problem right now is I am on Denette's membership (so - will buy lots there) AND there are so many truly great batches coming out from folks like Okie's, Treasure House and Sakti. And now I find out what we are *just* entering into the "good" season? Yipes - I am SO screwed.

to answer your first question...um, yes? not everyone is in your situation where they have more than they'll ever be able to take. I'm puzzled why you think everyone is in the same boat as you when it comes to that. must be nice to have your biggest problem being that you're able to buy as much kratom as you want, I guess.

I wish I had your problems. Yes, some of us are living on disability and need more kratom because it is a luxury. I am honored to receive free samples because sometimes that has been the difference between unbridled chronic pain and actually being able to functionally shower. I know there have to be other folks like me. I mean, I'm hear for the voyeurism and I like to pray pretend that I can afford a dingleberry from a llamas ass, but rent blew up, grocery costs blew up, med costs blew up and I'm a Crip that considers free samples a great charity and my reviews, returns on that. I am trying to find the words for the find folks at Nature's Cure for example, but how unbiased can I be when they took away my pain? Sorry about all this. But I think there is this understanding that everyone here has doomsday piles and have FOMO and try all the new vendors...I just parrot the good things I hear and try to participate in the culture when I can. But I lost everything. And I do want people to have fun and luxuriate, just as I would have once done, before I got sick and lost my career. Kratom and Disability life are not comfortable bedfellows and if the doc offers me opiates, the insurance will cover that. I'd be a fool to keep trying to get through a month otherwise.

Sorry. Hit an emotional nerve. It's not you, but me. In no way am I looking for handouts, but kratom krates were so kind with their samples and I thought the quality was quite good. Does it compare to D? Probably not, but I'm never going to try his stuff in this lifetime. Kratom Krates and other vendors with samplers not on 'the list' has helped me. Just sayin' that there are people like me here...but probably not for long.

I feel you on pretty much everything you said. I'm also on a fixed income. I can't relate to all the doomsday stash talk, all the "I just bought x amount from y vendor, but now I just have to buy more from z vendor because of a good review" talk. that's how a few people are, but I don't believe that's the common consensus, or that the unspoken "understanding" here is that everyone has so much kratom, so little time. anyway, you're not the only one.

[Kelleytoons]

First of all - sorry I didn't mean to sound glib about having so much. There are lots of folks here who do and who have the same sort of buying patterns I have so I was kind of making a joke but it wasn't meant to be at the expense of others who cannot (and in my defense I will note that I have PM'ed folks who complained about needing some offering to help for free and never heard back from them. And that's okay - some folks are offended by "hand outs" but in each case I made it perfectly clear I was "paying it forward" because LoveandPeace did it for me and I feel I need to do the same).

And I will also note, again, that I'm very, very old. Some of you who are in a position to not be able to buy all the Kratom you want are a LOT younger than I am and trust me when I tell you I'd give you all my possessions that I have to be your age. When you reach a certain age you just have more money than you can (easily and reasonably) spend and it isn't a fun time. I would MUCH rather have another decade of youth.

For those of you who ARE older and still can't afford to get what you need - I'll make the public offer. PM me and I'll see what I can do. BUT - you must be "old" (at least 65+) because, again, younger just means you have time to end up getting what you want. I know younger folks can't understand that, and patience isn't their strong suit, but is what it is. Most of you here will be around to taste the wonders of Kratom for many many decades after I've gone. I have zero sympathy for you not being able to get all you want now.

[gumbyke1]

Vendor (TFH) here who literally sends out THOUSANDS and THOUSANDS of free samples each year - thought I would chime in.

Samples play a MAJOR role in how we operate, but not for the reasons most people might assume. We include free samples with each order as both a courtesy to our customers, and as a way for us to obtain valuable consumer feedback via our private online sample survey. Whether it's to test new production techniques, new sources, or just to add more data to items already on the menu - information on samples is the cornerstone of our whole operation. We have a close connection with most of our members and there is a good understanding that when we provide free samples with thier order, we really appreciate their evaluation of them in return (in the form of a private online survey). When making a purchase, quality surveys are not required or even expected, but the majority of our members understand the value of their contributions, and in the grand scheme of things as it only benefits them in the long run to provide it. I know my customer pretty well, so occasionally I will make some samples specifically for them as a courtesy because I think they are sleeping on it a batch I know they will love, but outside of that its all about the research!

Regarding vendors requesting that you cover the cost of shipping free samples, I think it's a completely reasonable request. In fact, for a lot of companies it is likely the only way they can feasibly do so on a regular basis. Unless a vendor is charging more for "shipping" than what they actually pay to ship it, I dont think its some trick they pull to squeeze profit out of you (besides the obvious hope that it turns you into a customer - but that only happens if you want that).

With that said, unless they are doing major volume, kratom companies have to balance thier P&L and watch every dollar just like any other small business. Sending free products to one person is not that big of an expense, but it's never just one person, lol. Im not up to speed with how much powder companies typically send out for "free samples", but when we are recruiting testers for a major round of testing, we typically send anywhere from 80-130 grams worth of samples. That means we are basically sending a kilogram worth of product to every 7-12 testers! Again, we do samples for research, so to us it's a long-term investment that we very much find worth it. However, if we were sending samples strictly with the hope of converting customers, we would need probably need anywhere from 2-4 of those folks to make a purchase for the math of the money to make sense (obviously it depends on what they buy). There absolutely are folks who request free samples with the intention of potentially placing an order, but there are also a lot of folks who also have no intention of making a purchase whatsoever, no matter how great your product is. Something that you dont necessarily think of is that a lot of the folks who are searching for companies that are offering free samples are doing so because they dont have the money to place an order to begin with (and who can blame them, lol) . I dont know the economics of each kratom company, but I do know that you are sending samples purely for the purpose of converting customers, the margins dont always add up once you account for taxes (which is like 25% of the profit shaved away instantly), operating overhead, and those special expenses that are exclusive to the kratom industry (lost/bad product).

A tiny minority of vendors who pop up first in the google search are doing VERY well... so well that not every dollar counts (huge vendors have a lot of advantages). However, the vast, vast majority of vendors are just trying to survive like any other small business in this climate. People forget that vendors have all of the normal business expenses (taxes, overhead, labor, etc). Still, they also have to contend with an extra special expense that occasionally pops up called losing an entire shipment to seizure, theft, or just receiving a poor quality product that you cant offer your customers with a good conscience (seriously, you have to make a lot of sales to cover the cost of that 100kg batch that you cant offer to your customers because it was a dud batch). For some vendors, it can take 6 months' worth of revenue to make up the cost of a seized shipment or theft from a supplier. Imagine working 6 months for "free" at your job to pay for a mistake you made, lol. I'm not at all suggesting we throw a pity party for vendors, I'm just saying that maintaining a profit can sometimes be tricky in this industry if you are not judicious with managing your expenses. If you dont plan for problems and are just "loose" with how you spend, you can easily run into problems that become the "end" of your company. Its well known that companies in this industry come and go, and even those who were recognized as "successful" sometimes suddenly disappear....its for a reason.

All of what I shared just shared is if the customer is paying for shipping. If the vendor has to accept another $4-$8 shipping expense on top of that, that could easily tip the scales towards something that isnt feasible on a regular basis. In our case, if we shipped samples to 10 people, that's about $70 in shipping and a kilogram of product used...it can add up quickly! Sure, there are sometimes wise reasons to take a hit to the bottom line (like trying to get your product known), but a lot of companies might not do the volume to be able to do that regularly. Still - there are companies that ship samples for free, so whatever it is it makes sense for them to do so. They might be taking a loss to gain traction, dangling some amazing samples they know will entice people to buy, or they found some product on the cheap and have some large margins to play with. Whatever it is, they are doing it because it makes business sense to do so.... good on them!


Again I dont know the economics of other companies, but I know we absorb a rather large expense in product due to the sheer volume of powder we give away (and we dont even cover the cost of shipping). There is no way for me to know, but I would guess that we send out more free powder than anyone in a similar volume group...it adds up. Most of our testing these days is done by adding test samples to customer orders, so we dont really contend with the "shipping expense" issue anymore. However, if we were to solicit testers on the forum (which we should do again soon.... it's been a while), we absolutely would be requesting that the testers pay for shipping. When asking testers to pay for that shipping, we try to make it worth it by providing at least 100g of samples and in the last round of testing we help, we offered testers opportunity to make a one-time purchase of any samples that they loved (we are normally not open to the public). With that said, we dont send out all of this free powder because we are just nice people, we are absolutely getting something out of it that furthers our goals. For us, the expense pays for itself in the form of us obtaining valuable product data, gaining invaluable intellectual property, and having customers who frequently return because they value our process and trust the products it produces. The cost of sending all of those samples has been just baked into our operating budget since day one (actually its been there since before we even knew we were a business, lol).

Obviously, consumers have to contend with the fact that some vendors are more diligent in sourcing quality products than others. In addition, there are some real issues created by the ugly existence of personal chemistry (I did a whole write-up on how personal chemistry plays a role... I can dig up the link and paste it below if anyone wants to read it). With that said, I totally see the value of free samples, and I celebrate the fact that they are out there for consumers! Thankfully, there are some good kratom vendors to choose from these days (some of which are highlighted on this forum).... find you a good one and you can rely a little more on thier diligence, and a little less of sifting through samples

PS - we have a ton of stuff in testing right now. If any members are interested in participating in this round, please let me know!

[Markra]

I want to participate in this round pls sir!

[whoisseananyway]

PS - we have a ton of stuff in testing right now. If any members are interested in participating in this round, please let me know!

Are you referring to current TFH members, or members of this forum? If you mean the latter, then I'm definitely interested.

[Arob1000]

With that said, unless they are doing major volume, kratom companies have to balance thier P&L and watch every dollar just like any other small business. Sending free products to one person is not that big of an expense, but it's never just one person, lol. Im not up to speed with how much powder companies typically send out for "free samples", but when we are recruiting testers for a major round of testing, we typically send anywhere from 80-130 grams worth of samples. That means we are basically sending a kilogram worth of product to every 7-12 testers! Again, we do samples for research, so to us it's a long-term investment that we very much find worth it. However, if we were sending samples strictly with the hope of converting customers, we would need probably need anywhere from 2-4 of those folks to make a purchase for the math of the money to make sense (obviously it depends on what they buy). There absolutely are folks who request free samples with the intention of potentially placing an order, but there are also a lot of folks who also have no intention of making a purchase whatsoever, no matter how great your product is. Something that you dont necessarily think of is that a lot of the folks who are searching for companies that are offering free samples are doing so because they dont have the money to place an order to begin with (and who can blame them, lol) . I dont know the economics of each kratom company, but I do know that you are sending samples purely for the purpose of converting customers, the margins dont always add up once you account for taxes (which is like 25% of the profit shaved away instantly), operating overhead, and those special expenses that are exclusive to the kratom industry (lost/bad product).

You guys are doing it right. Worth the expense to test so frequently to ensure consistent quality product. I wish more vendors did this/made the "testing results" public. It would make it a lot easier for customers to choose from a complicated menu without combing the internet for reviews. I'm unfortunately not a member but was lucky enough to grab some product in your public sale last year, really high quality stuff!

[gumbyke1]

PS - we have a ton of stuff in testing right now. If any members are interested in participating in this round, please let me know!

Are you referring to current TFH members, or members of this forum? If you mean the latter, then I'm definitely interested.

Sorry for the confusion, I was referring TFH members.

However, it has been a long time since we have asked our favorite online community for help...time to change that! Im going to make a post right now to recruit folks who are interested in testing...we have a ton of stuff we could use surveys on! Thanks!

[gumbyke1]

we've always had free samples.... but we ask that it be a one time thing... We have had folks abuse it; sad but true. I mean,we certainly want to help those in need, and hold regular give aways, but why try to take advantage? It's much easier to let folks know, "hey, I need help." We all have vices, and can relate, but we have limits to what we can do feasibly.

Free means free to me.... I mean, most samples are the left overs from bagging, so paying for shipping is really negligible. I know vendors do it different, but we try to be transparent, it's a marketing expense for us.. if you stand by your product, let it stand for itself.

edit: we typically only get to send sample one day a week due to bagging schedules.

I totally missed this post earlier, but there you have a model that makes perfect sense. Good stuff Shaun, I love what you guys are doing!

[Arob1000]

PS - we have a ton of stuff in testing right now. If any members are interested in participating in this round, please let me know!

Are you referring to current TFH members, or members of this forum? If you mean the latter, then I'm definitely interested.

Sorry for the confusion, I was referring TFH members.

However, it has been a long time since we have asked our favorite online community for help...time to change that! Im going to make a post right now to recruit folks who are interested in testing...we have a ton of stuff we could use surveys on! Thanks!

Count me in!