Kratom had been hitting hard when I started, now nothing

[Back2K]

So I got off subs 10 days or so ago. Started using Kratom to transition. Didn’t do TO MUCH at first, but I could still feel something, even through the subs. Well on day 3 with no subs the Kratom started kicking in with a fury. It felt super powerful and euphoric and even my pupils were completely pinned, and I was feeling amazing from just one dose for hours. I then got some extract on the 6th day and took one gold reserve capsule with some red maeng da, and got a horrible case of the wobbles that made me throw up and even shake uncontrollably for a few seconds.

And now since then for the past three days, practically nothing. It maybe helps to make me feel normal and give me effects now even lesser than drinking a redbull. Yet the other day I felt like I was on some powerful stuff. No idea how it could change so drastically so quickly from one case of the wobbles. Any ideas on what happened, or what I could do?

[YngwieShreds]

I think tolerance gets spiked when you do too much, but as a beginner it's kind of early for that. What's the dosage size?

[Back2K]

I think tolerance gets spiked when you do too much, but as a beginner it's kind of early for that. What's the dosage size?

I had only even been doing like 2-3 grams and feeling amazing, now Im trying 5 or so and nothing. I think the wobbles destroyed my tolerance or something

[YngwieShreds]

I remember when I started I used a dose higher 5han that probably 7g, and then after a month or two I had to do more, about 10 to 12g to get any effects. Then I stayed at that level for about a year or two, but I never measured consistently,just knew I had to increase. Its said you develop a tolerance very quickly to kratom if you do it daily, which is true. Try a couple things like taking on an empty stomach and making sure there is at least 6 hours between doses.its understandable that your tolerance went up, but you're too new to lose all the effects from tolerance and you should be able to get the effects by increasing. But, if you get the wobbles when you increase, that's usually because you did too much or stacked doses too close together.

[Back2K]

A couple of Botanical bunny mixed with tfh strains seems to be doing at least moderate effects in like a 5 gram dose

[YngwieShreds]

A couple of Botanical bunny mixed with tfh strains seems to be doing at least moderate effects in like a 5 gram dose

And no wobbles or undesirable effects from 5g?

[herbalhippie]

You need to be rotating strains and vendors.

[Back2K]

A couple of Botanical bunny mixed with tfh strains seems to be doing at least moderate effects in like a 5 gram dose

And no wobbles or undesirable effects from 5g?

Yeah. And the time I got the wobbles I took about 4 grams of red maeng da thai from phytoextractum and one capsule of gold reserve. And it was insanely powerful wobbles. I felt great after the most intense part if I laid down, but standing up was a no go. It was weird because before and after that I could take 3 gold reserve caps in a day, and take a bunch of that red marng da and even take some Botanical Bunny PMD and not be getting the wobbles, so I dont know why I got them so bad.

Even the day after the wobbles, the red maeng da made me fee great by itself. Now nothing.

Im actually noticing pretty strong effects for the first time in 3 days now though. I took 2 grams of BB Kapuas Green, 1.5 grams of premium maeng da batch 2005, 1 gram of TFH jade indo ssv, and 1 gram of mellow yellow PMD all mixed together. The blend is fast but with a bit of chill eiphoria at the same time. Botanical Bunny kratom seems to always hit for me, I just hadn’t tried it
The past few days for some reason. I was taking capsules and treating it more like a substance abuse.

Dam this is actually hitting good. Im happy now lol. Like, really good. I may just blend al of that kratom together!

[YngwieShreds]

I remember I hit a wall and had to pretty much double my dose, so you might find 6 to 7 works for you

[Back2K]

I remember I hit a wall and had to pretty much double my dose, so you might find 6 to 7 works for you

5.5 of my botanical bunny and texas family harvest blend is slapping right now finally. Feels great after nothing for 2-3 days

[Back2K]

I remember when I started I used a dose higher 5han that probably 7g, and then after a month or two I had to do more, about 10 to 12g to get any effects. Then I stayed at that level for about a year or two, but I never measured consistently,just knew I had to increase. Its said you develop a tolerance very quickly to kratom if you do it daily, which is true. Try a couple things like taking on an empty stomach and making sure there is at least 6 hours between doses.its understandable that your tolerance went up, but you're too new to lose all the effects from tolerance and you should be able to get the effects by increasing. But, if you get the wobbles when you increase, that's usually because you did too much or stacked doses too close together.

Yes I need a scale. I gave pretty precise dosages for having just guessed. Doesn’t help the BB kratom is dry and tfh kratom is wet. Im going to stop on the tfh unti I get a scale because my “5.5 gram” dose could have been any random amount. It was just an estimate based on what I always used to take back in 2013 when I used to take Kratom.

[acejestyr15]

The wobbles didn't wreck you tolerance... That was the extracts. They aren't anywhere near worth using to be honest!! They completely destroy your tolerance, are rarely very balanced, and they just aren't usually worth the price increase and sacrifices that go along with.

[YngwieShreds]

I remember I hit a wall and had to pretty much double my dose, so you might find 6 to 7 works for you

5.5 of my botanical bunny and texas family harvest blend is slapping right now finally. Feels great after nothing for 2-3 days

Awesome!

[CatfatherB]

Yngwie Malmsteen fan? Damn right he shreds!!

[BallzDeep9]

5.5 of my botanical bunny and texas family harvest blend is slapping right now finally. Feels great after nothing for 2-3 days

I go back to the elevator analogy, kratom as a partial agonist will never give full opioid effects.. the Kratom Elevator only goes to the 3rd floor, Oxy gets you to 5th.. So we must keep some "headroom" otherwise, elevator gets stuck!! Maxing out your receptors w/ extract.. you got hung-up there, for a couple days. Taking more kratom only give you wobbles at that point.. Less Is More! That's just how it works.. Yes a majority seem to be abusing the leaf and wondering why lol..

You waited a few days, for elevator to free up.. Its a balancing act . In the Future, more will be known about how to manage our receptors for best effect.. Also why some people have a higher tolerance ? or non responders etc. its still a Magical Mystery!

[YngwieShreds]

Yngwie Malmsteen fan? Damn right he shreds!!

That's right. He rules.

[CatfatherB]

Yngwie Malmsteen fan? Damn right he shreds!!

That's right. He rules.

I know this is off topic but years ago I saw him at the Ryman auditorium at the G3 concert...it was him and Joe Satriani and..I think it was Steve Vai but Malmsteen was the most entertaining of the bunch, I thought anyway..

And by the way welcome to DoubleM, Yngwie!

[YngwieShreds]

Yngwie Malmsteen fan? Damn right he shreds!!

That's right. He rules.

I know this is off topic but years ago I saw him at the Ryman auditorium at the G3 concert...it was him and Joe Satriani and..I think it was Steve Vai but Malmsteen was the most entertaining of the bunch, I thought anyway..

And by the way welcome to DoubleM, Yngwie!

Nice! I've seen him a few times over the years. Always entertaining, but I wish I could have seen him in 84/85 when he was at his best

[gopher]

I had a sort of similar experience when I was getting off of methadone a couple months ago. I was feeling okay the first few days of w/d from 1-3 grams of kratom 4 times a day, but when day 4 or 5 came around, nothing. I had read that cutting your dose in half at this point is the way to go so I tried that and after a couple hours of straight wiggling in my bed between liquid shits, I took like 6 grams and felt the best I had since the w/d started. Sounds sort of obvious now typing it out lol. But for the rest of w/d I kept dosing 2-4 grams at a time, but between 6-10 times a day. I got a little bit wobbly if I tried to push the dose too high at any real frequency so maybe that played a part in your case as well. The number of doses started getting less and less as I started sleeping for longer periods. I was at 4 doses a day for minute and finally to 3 which is where I'm at now and will probably stay for good while. A couple times I've tried to take north of 6 grams and got wobbles pretty bad, but I took 6 earlier today and was more than fine. I read something that seems plausible saying it's because of a build up of some lesser known alkaloids found in kratom. And by that they mean MAGIC

[Love_Redz]

It’s the subs your coming off of, they are strong meds so you’ll have good burns sometimes and not so good others, sub withdrawals hit harder after some dayz off keep doing what your doing cause you’ll be a lot worse without leaf, your tolerance didn’t reck that soon with leaf or extract but I would stay off the extracts, the coming off the subs is what’s causing the problems good luck my friend, very good advice from everyone, you might have to be on a higher dose at first but once you start feeling better lower your dose

[Greyfeather]

I then got some extract on the 6th day and took one gold reserve capsule with some red maeng da, and got a horrible case of the wobbles that made me throw up and even shake uncontrollably for a few seconds.

I would guess that this is your problem. Using extracts is known to disrupt tolerance quickly.

[Greyfeather]

Doesn’t help the BB kratom is dry and tfh kratom is wet.

.

This is a very interesting observation, Back2K. I have never heard kratom described as "wet" (unless it has been compromised).

Could you say more about this? I haven't had any kratom from Botanical Bunny yet.

[creatus]

Doesn’t help the BB kratom is dry and tfh kratom is wet.

I'm glad you mentioned that, I was actually going to post asking if anyone had suggestions for "dry kratom". This morning I burned an old MS batch circa 2016 that was the most "dry" kratom I've had, no clumping at all, just powder. It has provided a good balance with TFH kratom in rotation. The TFH leaf forms perfect little ice-cream scoops when you measure because of how it sticks together. Maybe the vacuum seal has to do with this and obviously drying / grinding.

[BigD]

I too have experienced good results in the beginning with just one teaspoon and now I have doubled my dose and not really experiencing any energy or mood lifting effects just gut rot and dizziness. I have tried to lower the dose again but that is not working

[Back2K]

I had a sort of similar experience when I was getting off of methadone a couple months ago. I was feeling okay the first few days of w/d from 1-3 grams of kratom 4 times a day, but when day 4 or 5 came around, nothing. I had read that cutting your dose in half at this point is the way to go so I tried that and after a couple hours of straight wiggling in my bed between liquid shits, I took like 6 grams and felt the best I had since the w/d started. Sounds sort of obvious now typing it out lol. But for the rest of w/d I kept dosing 2-4 grams at a time, but between 6-10 times a day. I got a little bit wobbly if I tried to push the dose too high at any real frequency so maybe that played a part in your case as well. The number of doses started getting less and less as I started sleeping for longer periods. I was at 4 doses a day for minute and finally to 3 which is where I'm at now and will probably stay for good while. A couple times I've tried to take north of 6 grams and got wobbles pretty bad, but I took 6 earlier today and was more than fine. I read something that seems plausible saying it's because of a build up of some lesser known alkaloids found in kratom. And by that they mean MAGIC

I finally got a scale today and I found I need about 6.5-7 grams of plain leaf for a good burn, and I was taking to little before. It’s also thankfully still working pretty well if I just take plain leaf, but the effects are way shorter than if I enhance it with some extract. Just Kratom alone gives me a way better feeling full spectrum burn, which I love about Kratom. But the effects seem to only last an hour for me. If I take some Kratom, let it kick in, then down about 0.85 grams of extract after it kicks in, the full spectrum burn fades into just euphoria and it lasts about 6 hours+. Pretty awesome stuff!

[Back2K]

I too have experienced good results in the beginning with just one teaspoon and now I have doubled my dose and not really experiencing any energy or mood lifting effects just gut rot and dizziness. I have tried to lower the dose again but that is not working

Get a scale, it’s what I needed. I know the “less is more” mantra, but I was taking not enough and had to basically double my dose. I found out I was only taking 3-3.5 grams. Find what works for you then dose consistently. I have to take about 7 grams of Kratom, which for TFH leaf is about two heaping spoonfulls (like a normal cereal spoon).

Consider maybe enhancing your leaf with some extract, maybe 0.5-0.85 grams of extract, and 3-4 grams of plain leaf. Be careful of overdoing it though! Also, I took extract everyday for the past week or more, and I can still get a burn from normal Kratom. It just doesn’t last as long.

Kratom is back in action for me, at least for now. I think the subs were fucking with my brain still, even after the first few days off. But today will be day 12, and I think it’s finally out of my system for the most part. Good luck!

[Back2K]

Doesn’t help the BB kratom is dry and tfh kratom is wet.

.

This is a very interesting observation, Back2K. I have never heard kratom described as "wet" (unless it has been compromised).

Could you say more about this? I haven't had any kratom from Botanical Bunny yet.

I didn’t mean wet I just meant fresh and a bit more moisture/clumpy. It’s really good actually.

[BigD]

I too have experienced good results in the beginning with just one teaspoon and now I have doubled my dose and not really experiencing any energy or mood lifting effects just gut rot and dizziness. I have tried to lower the dose again but that is not working

Get a scale, it’s what I needed. I know the “less is more” mantra, but I was taking not enough and had to basically double my dose. I found out I was only taking 3-3.5 grams. Find what works for you then dose consistently. I have to take about 7 grams of Kratom, which for TFH leaf is about two heaping spoonfulls (like a normal cereal spoon).

Consider maybe enhancing your leaf with some extract, maybe 0.5-0.85 grams of extract, and 3-4 grams of plain leaf. Be careful of overdoing it though! Also, I took extract everyday for the past week or more, and I can still get a burn from normal Kratom. It just doesn’t last as long.

Kratom is back in action for me, at least for now. I think the subs were fucking with my brain still, even after the first few days off. But today will be day 12, and I think it’s finally out of my system for the most part. Good luck!

Thats great!! you think I need bigger doses even tho I'm experiencing dizziness and nausea but that's it?? i was weighing it out ..i was taking 5 grams and only getting dizzy and nauseous but not much pain relief or anything else

[Mean Malay]

I too have experienced good results in the beginning with just one teaspoon and now I have doubled my dose and not really experiencing any energy or mood lifting effects just gut rot and dizziness. I have tried to lower the dose again but that is not working

Get a scale, it’s what I needed. I know the “less is more” mantra, but I was taking not enough and had to basically double my dose. I found out I was only taking 3-3.5 grams. Find what works for you then dose consistently. I have to take about 7 grams of Kratom, which for TFH leaf is about two heaping spoonfulls (like a normal cereal spoon).

Consider maybe enhancing your leaf with some extract, maybe 0.5-0.85 grams of extract, and 3-4 grams of plain leaf. Be careful of overdoing it though! Also, I took extract everyday for the past week or more, and I can still get a burn from normal Kratom. It just doesn’t last as long.

Kratom is back in action for me, at least for now. I think the subs were fucking with my brain still, even after the first few days off. But today will be day 12, and I think it’s finally out of my system for the most part. Good luck!

so you had to take double THF dosage for similar effects? I've heard great things about his kratom, but you're essentially paying double the price since you have to take twice as much, no?

[Siegebruce]

We need a "it's tolerance" emoji for questions like these