3-4 Days of Dosing with Limited Effects

[Laika]

I started dosing daily two weeks ago due to the extra free time I currently have due to quarantine. I had been using kratom 2-3 times per week for 3 years before that.

I've been taking ~10g per day for the past couple of weeks in 3 doses of roughly 3g per dose. I usually take a white around 11, a green around 3, and then a red around 6. For the first week or so I had daily mood lift/euphoria and great energy. For the past 3-4 days, I haven't experienced much of anything in terms of effects. It's like a switched has been turned off.

All of the kratom I have been using for the past week has consisted of well-reviewed/popular strains from reputable vendors reviewed here. I've tried rotating strains though I continue to take specific "colors" at certain times of the day.

I'm grateful for any advice regarding how to bring back "the magic."

[BigD]

From what I read I think you need to spread your doses further apart. They say a minimum of five hours between. I know it sucks when the honeymoon is over and it stops working!

[Laika]

Thanks for letting me know. I guess my reasoning is that I want to give my body time to process the previous day's dose before I start dosing the next day.

[RumRunner]

From what I read I think you need to spread your doses further apart. They say a minimum of five hours between. I know it sucks when the honeymoon is over and it stops working!

This is good advice. Your doses are too close together. I would take it a step further.....space your doses at least 7 or 8 hours apart, especially if you’re taking it for mood lift. If you’re still feeling “after-glow” from a previous burn, skip that dose. Try not to take it because the clock tells you it’s time to. Allow your body to get back to normal for a period of time.

[fusedflora]

I agree as well, your doses aren't far enough apart and your tolerance is building too quickly.

So other things it could be: sickness (burn effects tend to decrease when immune system is busy), diet (if you've gotten off keto or a alkaline diet you could expect burn effects to decrease), or exercise (if you have stopped exercising your burns effects could decrease). Due to the nature of the quarantine, folks eating more being bored at home and not exercising as much for staying in, these could likely be the issue too, but I'm with everyone that the most likely issue is dose spacing.

[YngwieShreds]

You went from not doing it daily to doing it daily, so now you've probably got a bit of tolerance going. Your doses are still pretty low, but taking them more frequently lately has probably upped your tolerance. You can try upping your dosage and spreading them further apart. I'm sure that will bring it back, but then it's a dangerous game if you keep doing it daily. You will notice the same thing, you get a good burn for a while and then nothing, and you'll be tempted to increase.

I was a drinker for 15 years and even alcohol tolerance seems to build slower than kratom tolerance.

[Laika]

From what I read I think you need to spread your doses further apart. They say a minimum of five hours between. I know it sucks when the honeymoon is over and it stops working!

This is good advice. Your doses are too close together. I would take it a step further.....space your doses at least 7 or 8 hours apart, especially if you’re taking it for mood lift. If you’re still feeling “after-glow” from a previous burn, skip that dose. Try not to take it because the clock tells you it’s time to. Allow your body to get back to normal for a period of time.

Thanks, I didn't realize that it's important to let a previous dose burn out completely before dosing again. I've enjoyed going through my days lately in a "kratom haze"

[Laika]

I agree as well, your doses aren't far enough apart and your tolerance is building too quickly.

So other things it could be: sickness (burn effects tend to decrease when immune system is busy), diet (if you've gotten off keto or a alkaline diet you could expect burn effects to decrease), or exercise (if you have stopped exercising your burns effects could decrease). Due to the nature of the quarantine, folks eating more being bored at home and not exercising as much for staying in, these could likely be the issue too, but I'm with everyone that the most likely issue is dose spacing.

Yeah, I've been exercising daily and eating fewer calories.

The thing about dose spacing is that not even my first dose brings much of a mood lift, which is typically spaced 16 hours from my last dose the previous day.

[Laika]

You went from not doing it daily to doing it daily, so now you've probably got a bit of tolerance going. Your doses are still pretty low, but taking them more frequently lately has probably upped your tolerance. You can try upping your dosage and spreading them further apart. I'm sure that will bring it back, but then it's a dangerous game if you keep doing it daily. You will notice the same thing, you get a good burn for a while and then nothing, and you'll be tempted to increase.

I was a drinker for 15 years and even alcohol tolerance seems to build slower than kratom tolerance.

Yeah, I just deviated from my plan and did an extra teaspoon. I guess this is what they call chasing the dragon...

[Laika]

Alright... In an attempt to lower my dose and try to restore some of the euphoric effects of kratom, here's my plan tomorrow:

7: Small breakfast and coffee

10: Two teaspoons (one white and one green)... Maybe small coffee
Workout following this dose

1230: Lunch

5: Two teaspoons (one green and one red)

And then moving forward see if I can get down to three total teaspoons for the day

[YngwieShreds]

That's better, plus I highly recommend either taking days off or every other day just doing one serving.

You don't want to find yourself up around 40g per day like me! I'm currently tapering back because I only get slight effects, sometimes none at all.

[flybye99928]

i would also say, ime, it may take a couple days for things to level out and desired fx to return

[Laika]

That's better, plus I highly recommend either taking days off or every other day just doing one serving.

You don't want to find yourself up around 40g per day like me! I'm currently tapering back because I only get slight effects, sometimes none at all.

Yeah I guess I have a bit of a fear of side effects and getting a shitty night's sleep at this point.

i would also say, ime, it may take a couple days for things to level out and desired fx to return

Yeah, I kind of expect that. Plus, I slipped up and had a heavy day. I just read a thread with a lot of helpful information about managing tolerance and will take something to help reduce tolerance over the next few nights.

[Klyded]

I think it is really important to adjust ones expectations along with their routine and dosage.

If your in need every 3 hours due to chronic pain you will have a wholly different experience and program than someone enjoying recreationally.

Daily users must play by different rules with amended perspective than than those who indulge sporadically throughout the week.

[acejestyr15]

I think it is really important to adjust ones expectations along with their routine and dosage.

If your in need every 3 hours due to chronic pain you will have a wholly different experience and program than someone enjoying recreationally.

Daily users must play by different rules with amended perspective than than those who indulge sporadically throughout the week.

Very well said!!

I am considered a high dose person especially here and more and more so recently.... as well I am also a daily Kratom user. I utilize kratom for multiple reasons mostly chronic pain, insomnia, mood boost, and fatigue/energy because of the insomnia but I can also say that with the right schedule/routine and some rules set for myself I still seem to get great effects from at very least 75% of my servings every single day! I consider this to be a bigtime win, and attribute it all to combo of luckily good metabolism, good scheduling and control, strain/batch/vendor rotation, and a ton of trial and error lol.

And yes, I do agree that very rarely can any individual sustain good effects from servings every 3 to 4 hours....some say even difficult when taking servings every 4 to 6 hours. I personally, have found that 4 to 6 works well enough as long as I don't start gravitating to a habitual every 4hours at least!! Just like anything in this world....gotta stick with what works for you, hold yourself accountable, and keep in mind that gotta do some experimenting sometimes to learn certain aspects whether good or bad.

[Klyded]

I personally, have found that 4 to 6 works well enough as long as I don't start gravitating to a habitual every 4hours at least!! Just like anything in this world....gotta stick with what works for you, hold yourself accountable, and keep in mind that gotta do some experimenting sometimes to learn certain aspects whether good or bad.

I agree with this entirely. 4 to 6 is the sweet zone for me with a solid 8 hour stretch somewhere in the mix. I was recently at a steady 5gpd twice or three times a day. That was a fabulous strategy until various meat-suit-related-malfunctions flared up resulting in surreal pain. Last couple weeks I've been at an embarrassingly high volume and frequency...

... but you hit the nail on the head when you say sometimes you absolutely have to turn yourself into a real science experiment and data. As such, what I've found works for me better than anything else to get the mojo running is...

EXCLUSIVITY: I use my favorites least frequently.
CONTRAST: If I am really looking forward to a slow euphoric red, I take mild and clear minded greens exclusively for quite a few doses leading up to it. The green doses are always a gram or two short of the red I am looking forward to. Being consistent with my mid-greens and NOT mixing them up too much with other colors. Helps me appreciate the nuances of my favorites without things getting too "same-ee". Put the 8 hours window beforehand and BAM
WHITE OR YELLOW DAY: Totally at random I'll do a whole day on strictly my favorite white's or yellow's and golly can that be novel experience!
POTENTIATE: Emphasize particular dose with DLPA. I've always found most methods of potentiation to be or minimally impacting, but DLPA is a complete game changer for me. I take 750mg a bit before a dose and it's always a sure-fire hit.
FERMENTED: I tried doing a few days straight of only picking fermented strains and then smacking myself silly with something bright green! LOL- this worked surprisingly well for me believe it or not.

When one is engaging in ANYTHING multiple times a day, every day, one must become creative in how to dodge a routine.

Not saying anything I've expressed is fundamentally true for anyone else- different strokes as the expression goes... But figuring out how to do the exact same thing differently is what works for me to keep my perspective and perception working for me instead of against me- keeping the "magic"

I feel like I'm keyboard rambling now but golly, the science of how to enjoy your leaf proper is a fascinating topic!

[MycatTimmy]

What DLPA do you use ? When and how much do you take ? I took PEA Saturday night and today has been the first day that I’ve been able to feel my dose. Yesterday I didn’t take anything at all. I thought that I was being very careful with tolerance. I’ve taken < than 10 GPD since May 8. I rotate colors and batches religiously. I take 2 day breaks frequently but I’m still not getting good results. I only dose twice a day. I’m so frustrated that I’m ready to give up and just go back to my Tramadol. Help !!

[MycatTimmy]

I started dosing daily two weeks ago due to the extra free time I currently have due to quarantine. I had been using kratom 2-3 times per week for 3 years before that.

I've been taking ~10g per day for the past couple of weeks in 3 doses of roughly 3g per dose. I usually take a white around 11, a green around 3, and then a red around 6. For the first week or so I had daily mood lift/euphoria and great energy. For the past 3-4 days, I haven't experienced much of anything in terms of effects. It's like a switched has been turned off.

All of the kratom I have been using for the past week has consisted of well-reviewed/popular strains from reputable vendors reviewed here. I've tried rotating strains though I continue to take specific "colors" at certain times of the day.

I'm grateful for any advice regarding how to bring back "the magic."

I know exactly how you feel Laika

[Laika]

I personally, have found that 4 to 6 works well enough as long as I don't start gravitating to a habitual every 4hours at least!! Just like anything in this world....gotta stick with what works for you, hold yourself accountable, and keep in mind that gotta do some experimenting sometimes to learn certain aspects whether good or bad.

I agree with this entirely. 4 to 6 is the sweet zone for me with a solid 8 hour stretch somewhere in the mix. I was recently at a steady 5gpd twice or three times a day. That was a fabulous strategy until various meat-suit-related-malfunctions flared up resulting in surreal pain. Last couple weeks I've been at an embarrassingly high volume and frequency...

... but you hit the nail on the head when you say sometimes you absolutely have to turn yourself into a real science experiment and data. As such, what I've found works for me better than anything else to get the mojo running is...

EXCLUSIVITY: I use my favorites least frequently.
CONTRAST: If I am really looking forward to a slow euphoric red, I take mild and clear minded greens exclusively for quite a few doses leading up to it. The green doses are always a gram or two short of the red I am looking forward to. Being consistent with my mid-greens and NOT mixing them up too much with other colors. Helps me appreciate the nuances of my favorites without things getting too "same-ee". Put the 8 hours window beforehand and BAM
WHITE OR YELLOW DAY: Totally at random I'll do a whole day on strictly my favorite white's or yellow's and golly can that be novel experience!
POTENTIATE: Emphasize particular dose with DLPA. I've always found most methods of potentiation to be or minimally impacting, but DLPA is a complete game changer for me. I take 750mg a bit before a dose and it's always a sure-fire hit.
FERMENTED: I tried doing a few days straight of only picking fermented strains and then smacking myself silly with something bright green! LOL- this worked surprisingly well for me believe it or not.

When one is engaging in ANYTHING multiple times a day, every day, one must become creative in how to dodge a routine.

Not saying anything I've expressed is fundamentally true for anyone else- different strokes as the expression goes... But figuring out how to do the exact same thing differently is what works for me to keep my perspective and perception working for me instead of against me- keeping the "magic"

I feel like I'm keyboard rambling now but golly, the science of how to enjoy your leaf proper is a fascinating topic!

I think it is really important to adjust ones expectations along with their routine and dosage.

If your in need every 3 hours due to chronic pain you will have a wholly different experience and program than someone enjoying recreationally.

Daily users must play by different rules with amended perspective than than those who indulge sporadically throughout the week.

Very well said!!

I am considered a high dose person especially here and more and more so recently.... as well I am also a daily Kratom user. I utilize kratom for multiple reasons mostly chronic pain, insomnia, mood boost, and fatigue/energy because of the insomnia but I can also say that with the right schedule/routine and some rules set for myself I still seem to get great effects from at very least 75% of my servings every single day! I consider this to be a bigtime win, and attribute it all to combo of luckily good metabolism, good scheduling and control, strain/batch/vendor rotation, and a ton of trial and error lol.

And yes, I do agree that very rarely can any individual sustain good effects from servings every 3 to 4 hours....some say even difficult when taking servings every 4 to 6 hours. I personally, have found that 4 to 6 works well enough as long as I don't start gravitating to a habitual every 4hours at least!! Just like anything in this world....gotta stick with what works for you, hold yourself accountable, and keep in mind that gotta do some experimenting sometimes to learn certain aspects whether good or bad.

A lot of really good information here from what seems like veteran users.

As a brand new daily user, I was completely ignorant to the idea that you need to give you body time to process the first dose of the day before moving on to the second. I had no idea. But you live you learn and now I developed a dosing schedule to hopefully achieve better results.

I'm also taking magnesium and cat's claw to try to reverse some of what's been done to my tolerance over the past two weeks. I haven't dosed yet today and will only be dosing once today.

I'm also interested in the brand of DLPA mentioned by the above user--that will be the next addition to my fight against tolerance.

[Lnr9400]

What is this DLPA and PEA mentioned here?

[flybye99928]

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=3153

lots of info here on pea, dlpa bso and lots more

[Klyded]

What DLPA do you use ? When and how much do you take ? I took PEA Saturday night and today has been the first day that I’ve been able to feel my dose. Yesterday I didn’t take anything at all. I thought that I was being very careful with tolerance. I’ve taken < than 10 GPD since May 8. I rotate colors and batches religiously. I take 2 day breaks frequently but I’m still not getting good results. I only dose twice a day. I’m so frustrated that I’m ready to give up and just go back to my Tramadol. Help !!

My rule of thumb with DLPA is that the solid state caplets work way better for me than powder/capsules. That said, my top 2 are Source Naturals and Kal. The SN variety wakes me up a deal more than the Kal brand with the only notable difference being the inclusion of a small amount of calcium.

Source Naturals
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004GW9L9E?ta ... th=1&psc=1

Kal
https://www.amazon.com/KAL-DLPA-Tablets ... 955&sr=8-1

I usually take 750mg with 2 or 3 of my doses of kratom a day. I space this stuff out a bit further than the kratom but it hits on and compliments the very same notes- receptors- so I try to play by the same rules. Truth is, it works so well I'd be nearly as adamant about never running out the DLPA as I would kratom. Match made in heaven for me.

[Laika]

What DLPA do you use ? When and how much do you take ? I took PEA Saturday night and today has been the first day that I’ve been able to feel my dose. Yesterday I didn’t take anything at all. I thought that I was being very careful with tolerance. I’ve taken < than 10 GPD since May 8. I rotate colors and batches religiously. I take 2 day breaks frequently but I’m still not getting good results. I only dose twice a day. I’m so frustrated that I’m ready to give up and just go back to my Tramadol. Help !!

My rule of thumb with DLPA is that the solid state caplets work way better for me than powder/capsules. That said, my top 2 are Source Naturals and Kal. The SN variety wakes me up a deal more than the Kal brand with the only notable difference being the inclusion of a small amount of calcium.

Source Naturals
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004GW9L9E?ta ... th=1&psc=1

Kal
https://www.amazon.com/KAL-DLPA-Tablets ... 955&sr=8-1

I usually take 750mg with 2 or 3 of my doses of kratom a day. I space this stuff out a bit further than the kratom but it hits on and compliments the very same notes- receptors- so I try to play by the same rules. Truth is, it works so well I'd be nearly as adamant about never running out the DLPA as I would kratom. Match made in heaven for me.

I'm waiting on Amazon to ship my DLPA. It's crazy how slow Prime shipping is these days.

I picked up some Cat's Claw from the grocery store last night and took it before bed. My normal dose this morning and this evening made me nauseous and was much more intense. I'm not sure if it's because I'm taking two teaspoons at once now instead of taking one teaspoon and then an hour or so later taking another (as per guidance in this thread). Pretty ridiculous though. It's almost three hours after my evening dose and I'm still feeling nauseous. Not loving this side effect. Hopefully, my body adjusts soon. I'm all out of ginger capsules at the moment.

[Laika]

Since starting cat's claw and magnesium, kratom has made me nothing but nauseous. I threw up from a 3 gram dose this morning. I've never thrown up from kratom before. I think I might have to go off them.

[Payshince]

Laika,

I wouldn’t say that spreading your doses apart is an issue. Your dose times are perfectly fine. How many strains do you actually use?

I would guess that you need more diversity of batches/ strains!

(I have not read all the comments if this has been said already).

[Payshince]

Magnesium should be fine to take
Only take magnesium once per day at bedtime.

Maybe stop taking the Cats Claw it actually makes your tolerance worse in the long run, FYI!

[Payshince]

You shouldn’t be using the Same batches/ strains over and over and over. Of course you will eventually stop feeling those particular batches, this is how the plant works most times. Do not expect to always feel your most frequently used batches, I wish it worked that way believe me!