Im curious. Whats your personal view of a backpack seller?

[Zeniotuten]

Today there has been alot of newly revived chatter about some backpackers and there flocks of ppl that both love and hate the business thats handled.. Seems to me that there is a split down the middle between those that use and those that say they wouldnt do business with any.. I feel that to have a more sucessful knowledge of kratom and all that is involved with it, where would this business be without them? So many aspects of a backpackers Purpose seriously drives knowledge of many different vendors, strains and or basic information about so many different varieties. This argument is a touchy subject for me.. Asking this question will bring out a great many topics. Safety, cleanliness, and purity stand high on the list. There are so many ppl in the dark about how kratom is vended in todays market. Theres a central belief amongst kratomers about the leaf thats ingested..and where it comes from ..what its touched and who..and if its safe enough.. What are your thoughts..

[SpeciosaLife]

I’m curious to see if this topic gets any momentum. I’m new to this so my buying isn’t informed by ‘the good ‘ol days’ of open vendor discussion on reddit.

I’ve been following a couple markets in mewe to see who is generating the most demand and the trend seems to be towards backpack sellers, but that could be simply an indicator of who is participating in those mewe communities.

From where I’m sitting, the supply chain is completely obfuscated regardless of who I buy from. No source is ‘safer’ than any other and the market is completely unregulated.

At this point, my interest in backpack sellers is in what they can offer qualitatively. My success rate with commercial vendors has been pretty bad. About 10% has been great, 80% average, 10% really, really bad.

To your question, I’m somewhat under the impression that established vendors are moving a ton of product and have to liquidate it even if it’s average quality, whereas backpackers are staking their reputation on a very small selection. That said, my opinion of backpackers right now is that they are a source of consistent high quality.

[HigherStateD]

My success rate with commercial vendors has been pretty bad. About 10% has been great, 80% average, 10% really, really bad.
.

Could this be attributable to which strains work better for you than others?

[Zeniotuten]

First off.. There is a difference in level of backpackers that are out here. Some just buy with crypto and save a % of money and make a cushion for profit. Cash too. There are others that actually have relationships with some vendors and keep a constant eye on whats hot and whats not. And save those strains.. Me personally, i was a New vendor ...janurary 2017 was my launch.. Everything was perfect from my website..to my line of leaf.. I purchased a large amount and was set.. I literally lasted 2 weeks. In that span of time, i lost my processing a total of 4 times...it killed my business and put me in debt...so as far as backpacking is concerned, i personally had no choice but attempt to recoup some of the money i lost and pay down my debt. In short..the last 2 years has been a crazy up and down rollercoaster of a ride.. So for me personally, the term backpack doesnt truthfully tell the level of that person.. Or what there business model is .. Honestly there is a very short list of reputable backpackers. And the good ones have a long line of ppl that will vouche for them... It isnt hard to be honest or be trustworthy..and or clean.. The ppl that have dealt with them over and over trust that 1..they know there leaf..2 give great deals..3 are always available to them ..and 4.. Not in it strictly for the money. Those 4 attributes can easily seperate those sellers. From the rest of The pack.

[BallzDeep9]

Today there has been alot of newly revived chatter about some backpackers ...

Chatter like in Chat Rooms? lol - thats where it comes from. To help those NEW here, and those who don't hang out in online chat.. "backpack vendors" aka popups, started around 1 year ago as a joke. IIrc a fellow on Youtube known as Nerds Take On The World, coined the phrase?

Backpack traders were "Stash Sellers" individuals with NO website, and / or not having time or money, to start a business online.. But, some individuals became very well informed on kratom. Some of the peeps on Reddit became kratom collectors, and wanted to pass along the good stuff to others...

So.. when Swap-Sell on Reddit was banned in March of this year.. A bunch of folks started up MeWe & Discord.. chat rooms. Unlike Reddit, those places are mostly real time chat. Places for buying, selling, and trading your kratom.

That's the condensed version.. I have acquired some fantastic kratom from private sellers! One guy who really knows his stuff.. IS ZenioTuten, but he's probably too modest to say that lol - And others. Pretty much any wanna bee vendor, no website, selling from a Gmail account. Why? Various reasons. Good ones, are into the "kratom hobby" as collectors. Leaf hunters!! They sample, and import, quality leaf from Indo & pass it on to customers.

What about the bad ones? We've seen all kinds of bullshit happen on Swap Sell.. Ripoffs and exit scams? Yes. Petty bickering over who's got the best kratom? All the time... some backpack sellers wind up with lousy leaf. For sure. Just like any vendor.. So it boils down to.. reputation. Honesty. Legit reviews.. that's really all they have. Takes time to build that up. As a buyer - CAN you find quality at a fair price? Yes! But do your homework. Caveat Emptor!!

TL:DR - Backpack individuals have emerged over the past year, as sources for quality leaf. They don't have a business, OR a website. They trade and sell kratom from a "backpack" (Gmail account) in limited quantity. Buyers should not expect a large warehouse, clean room or lab testing. It's raw organic kratom direct from Indo.

[Zeniotuten]

Gentleman..and a scholar you are sir..still have a way with words ..you do.sir thank you for that..in this business, if your not helping you are truly hurting. I believe we keep this thing alive and thriving and definaelty keep it interesting.

[BlendsAreMyFriends]

***** This is a personal opinion and does not represent doublemherbals.com in any way.

FWIW I was considering adding this gentleman to the "vendors with samples" list when the SHTF on reddit. When we moved here we decided on criteria for adding vendors to the list. That left all backpack vendors off the list.

Zeniotuten has been around quite a while and I haven't seen any negative feedback about him. I would not have any personal reservations about dealing with him.

[e_poison]

I have no personal issues with backpack vendors, and have ordered kratom from a few of them. We welcome vendors of all types here - from the smallest backpackers to the biggest established vendors. More choice and more variety for consumers is always a good thing.

[Zeniotuten]

Its a lovely thing....kratom. Brings the best out of ppl that know what the worst of everything can be..

[herbalhippie]

The only 'backpack' vendor I've dealt with is Mr Smiley Time before he went full on vendor. I bought from him a few times and always got good leaf. What I like about creating a relationship with a backpack vendor is they get to know you and what you like. What big vendor is going to take the time to message you and say hey, I just got in a slow, euphoric green I think you'll really like? None, as far as I know.

So there are a few I'd buy from (you being one, Zen), because some of these guys have built up a reputation. They've worked at it over a pretty long period of time.

But the guy who comes out of nowhere and posts a vendor post that no one has ever heard of. I realize you've got to start somewhere but put in some time in the community first.

And let the buyer beware, like Ballz says.

[BallzDeep9]

We welcome vendors of all types here - from the smallest backpackers to the biggest established vendors.

OK but.. Individuals who sell stash, in private deals .. Not the same, as a public business who has invested $ in a Store.

I guess it's become a thing now, over the past few months.. The "backpack" guys have NO website to advertise... On every other Forum, Reddit, MeWe, Discord - Popup vendors have a dedicated place, called Swap Sell. Real vendors are not allowed in Swap Sell. Facebook is more complicated, they need a FB Group, kratom sales get banned by FB, etc.

There have been problems: rip-offs, drug dealing, fake accounts, arguments and people getting banned. Then it moved to MeWe. Within a few weeks.. bickering, blow ups and general BS.. Imo Zenio is good, ( we had one transaction like a year ago ). Others on MeWe made public accusations.. over money and kratom. I try to avoid drama but you can't help notice there's a problem..

Maybe I'm too old, but reminds me of High School pot dealers .. lol that was a long time ago, for me Does MM want this? Then let's have a separate Swap Sell board for popups and backpackers. That's what EVERY other place does. Admins sort out the inevitable BS. There should be some kind of Flair. Points for past "deals", That's how it works right?

Individuals, selling their Stash? Fine!! I've got some kilos to sell. I've traded with friends, too! Does that make me a Vendor, no!

ALSO what about Indo backpackers? Yes. Teenagers in Pontianak, popping up.. soliciting $ for kratom.. There are 100's of them on Facebook.. and they'll be coming HERE very soon. Are they "vendors" NO

EDIT: Keep It Simple. Vendors have a Domain & website. No vendors allowed in Swap Sell. No backpacks advertise under Vendors. Is that fair enough? Jmho and suggestion.

[Zeniotuten]

Yeah. Major differences. I more or less provide a service that no one else does or even would because 1..i dont make money and 2.. I lose money .every pack i make.. I consider myself a connoisseur's sample service for the new, and the bored ppl in our business..most ppl i require what there favorite vein is or what there looking to get out of leaf in general.. Work out the size and amounts ..and boom..i go to work..its almost like a blind sample service. Years of experience in it. And yes.. Mr. Smiley and. I have conversations daily. And have for almost the last 2 years. Friends in this business are golden..and knowledge is king. hence the reason ballz is so revelant still..all this time... I would never want to disrespect the working rules of this group or any other doubleM strand.. I appreciate the kind words from you guys. It ismt easy staying in the game but if you teuly care for your flock..your flock will stay with you!! #GOVOTE!!

[Kunlong]

I have a store and more than a couple people who sell to afford thier own. Thought about using them for delivery in thier area.

Nobody likes someone who is greed minded unabashedly and rakes price of any raggedy stuff. They even seem carny.

But I got nothing against the little guy selling the good stuff at a real price? It's free enterprise and lord knows thats all but vanished.
I mean whether they run a respectable bag is not always relative to thier minimum order, and Sulawesi and Frans imports can pack in plain ziplock and still be as good.

But headshops? Always big sucky $26 for 3 ozs of total "meh" leaf in a bag with a girl and some coconuts on it. Phooey of that!

[whiffypants]

I would never want to disrespect the working rules of this group or any other doubleM strand..

Don't worry, you're not. I can't speak on behalf of the other mods, but until/unless we post a specific policy about this, you have nothing to be concerned about.

Then again, we -know- you, and that alone goes a long way: someone who participates in the online community regularly is -- to me personally -- an entirely different vendor situation than one who shows up only to self-promote and then disappears back into the ether.

Also, to the best of my memory -- and I went back and checked my saved info to be sure of this -- before the Reddit ban, you only had to have one known good transaction and no known problems to post on the DoubleM sub. As long as vendors abided by the posted rules they were fine.

Ballz is correct in that most backpack/stash sellers went to r/swapsell, but it wasn't because it was forbidden on the DoubleM, it was because r/swapsell was a much better forum for smaller, non-CC transactions. Multiple "stash" sellers even had vendor flair on the DoubleM, like Wot and yourself. It wasn't prohibited by us at all. Just Reddit, in the end, who used our vendor flair list to target personal Reddit accounts as well as the subs they axed.

I have no idea what we as a group are going to do in regard to which vendors get to post what, but for myself, I personally would very much like to see you and all honest backpack/stash sellers succeed. I very much appreciate you sharing your thoughts with us here, as I do Ballz, because it's two sides of the exact same coin: how to identify and separate good vendors from bad in a way that is fair to all. Everything we learn from you, and vendors like you, will help us make a better set of decisions regarding vendors and the DoubleM, if/when we do so. So thanks for taking the time to raise the question and have this discussion.

[Zeniotuten]

Awesome!